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U.S., EU agree to trade deal framework that puts 15% tariffs on European goods

onthebottom

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In other words, that is what we will end up with. Except on energy. Which we should surcharge on.
I wonder if that’s true, I thought I read last week that Trump thought a EU deal was 50/50 and that Canada may just have to pay the tariffs. I could be wrong. I do know China is next up, meeting in Stockholm on Monday.

Australia taking US beef, Japan rice and direct investment, EU weapons, energy and direct investment. Been a few good weeks for the POTUS.
 

Frankfooter

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I wonder if that’s true, I thought I read last week that Trump thought a EU deal was 50/50 and that Canada may just have to pay the tariffs. I could be wrong. I do know China is next up, meeting in Stockholm on Monday.

Australia taking US beef, Japan rice and direct investment, EU weapons, energy and direct investment. Been a few good weeks for the POTUS.
Everyone just nods their heads and waits for him to go home.
The deals never happen.

 

WyattEarp

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May 17, 2017
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We shall see. I know the tourism numbers will be abysmal.
The U.S. economy is very diversified and complex. U.S. economy and trade are not even remotely dependent on foreign tourism. The Euro is worth 1.18. At some level, it will encourage some Americans to travel at home. It will be hard for Europeans to resist that FX rate beyond the short-run.

You don't want to sound like some of the guys throwing negativity at everything U.S. simply because you don't like our leader.
 

Frankfooter

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The U.S. economy is very diversified and complex. U.S. economy and trade are not even remotely dependent on foreign tourism. The Euro is worth 1.18. At some level, it will encourage some Americans to travel at home. It will be hard for Europeans to resist that FX rate beyond the short-run.

You don't want to sound like some of the guys throwing negativity at everything U.S. simply because you don't like our leader.
Who wants to visit the US and risk being disappeared by ICE?

 

Butler1000

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Oct 31, 2011
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The U.S. economy is very diversified and complex. U.S. economy and trade are not even remotely dependent on foreign tourism. The Euro is worth 1.18. At some level, it will encourage some Americans to travel at home. It will be hard for Europeans to resist that FX rate beyond the short-run.

You don't want to sound like some of the guys throwing negativity at everything U.S. simply because you don't like our leader.
Sure. But every bit helps. And when parts of the diversity falture it can affect the whole. And remember for every dollar that does not come in in foreign currency that's what, maybe 5x that in overall economic activity affected?

I think you would be surprised. If you are going to look at wxchange rate we kill you on that factor. There is already a rise in travel here. And you really aren't factoring in the emotional side. I know many people won't return there for years if ever. Our boycott is grassroots and won't be detered by a deal.

While we aren't actually blaming every American, we still won't deal with you the same way. And you need to factor in that to your assessment. I'm willing to pay more. So are many others.
 
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Butler1000

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I wonder if that’s true, I thought I read last week that Trump thought a EU deal was 50/50 and that Canada may just have to pay the tariffs. I could be wrong. I do know China is next up, meeting in Stockholm on Monday.

Australia taking US beef, Japan rice and direct investment, EU weapons, energy and direct investment. Been a few good weeks for the POTUS.
You aren't, imo factoring in whether people will buy the products.

Personally it looks like 15% will be the norm for now, and that will be the deal. Canada won't put tariffs on imo. Why raise our prices? We are boycotting, which is far more effective. You can't force us to buy wine, other products.
 

nottyboi

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May 14, 2008
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We probably do need Canadian oil, but all economic transactions hit a threshold where they become uneconomic. And of course, Canadians need to move Alberta oil to refineries and ports.

There's probably a very good reason why Canada hasn't built up its refinery infrastructure. I am aware of geographic limitations. I believe the Canadian Rockies make moving oil to British Columbia's ports challenging and costly. That's not even mentioning that Alberta oil is low-grade that requires more effort to refine.

I think trying to find ways to punish the U.S. is probably limited by economics as well as U.S. retaliatory power. As I said, I would love to read an objective explanation of U.S.-Canadian issues.
Canada had a refinery infrastructure. And there was a plan to ship oil across the nation via pipelines. But teh Albertans felt the National Energy plans was screwing them and that oil would be expensive forever. So they blew up the plan, and spend the next 3 decades suppling the USA with discounted oil and blaming Eastern Canada for not building a pipeline and living through several boom/bust cycles. . THE END.
 

nottyboi

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Economics knows no sentiment.

Canadian potash would likely be priced and taxed to a point where potash from outside North America is currently uncompetitive. Raising potash taxes would make global potash more competitive.
Canada is the largest producer by far, 2 and 3 are Russia and Belarus. Then CHina which does not export and then Germany that produces only 20% of what Canada produces.
 

WyattEarp

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May 17, 2017
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Sure. But every bit helps. And when parts of the diversity falture it can affect the whole. And remember for every dollar that does not come in in foreign currency that's what, maybe 5x that in overall economic activity affected?

I think you would be surprised. If you are going to look at wxchange rate we kill you on that factor. There is already a rise in travel here. And you really aren't factoring in the emotional side. I know many people won't return there for years if ever. Our boycott is grassroots and won't be detered by a deal.

While we aren't actually blaming every American, we still won't deal with you the same way. And you need to factor in that to your assessment. I'm willing to pay more. So are many others.
Tourism does even compare to the magnitude of the trade deficit. If you take that 5x multiplier, the U.S. trade deficit works the other way in dampening activity.

If you looking back at this thread, you're trying to come up with ways that Canada can hurt the U.S. I'm not sure there is much Canada can do because the U.S. is looking at a much bigger global problem than just some tourism dollars.
 

WyattEarp

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May 17, 2017
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Canada had a refinery infrastructure. And there was a plan to ship oil across the nation via pipelines. But teh Albertans felt the National Energy plans was screwing them and that oil would be expensive forever. So they blew up the plan, and spend the next 3 decades suppling the USA with discounted oil and blaming Eastern Canada for not building a pipeline and living through several boom/bust cycles. . THE END.
Oil prices have been structurally low since 2014. The Russian invasion of Ukraine in 2022 caused a brief spike.

If Russia agrees to a peace plan, I suspect that would put pressure on the $65 barrel price.
 

nottyboi

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Oil prices have been structurally low since 2014. The Russian invasion of Ukraine in 2022 caused a brief spike.

If Russia agrees to a peace plan, I suspect that would put pressure on the $65 barrel price.
Oil prices have been structurally low since 2014. The Russian invasion of Ukraine in 2022 caused a brief spike.

If Russia agrees to a peace plan, I suspect that would put pressure on the $65 barrel price.
Nothing will change if Russia agrees to a peace plan. Sanctions are not coming off and sanctions are not really affecting Russian oil exports right now as they are making it to China, India and Saudi. So the total volume of oil will not change, and thus prices will not really move. But it will be logistically difficult to supply Northen US refineries with the volume of oil to replace Canadian exports even if you could find it. Canada could in introduce supply management of oil to the US or just subsidize rail to move a portion of oil to an export port, or even just to Quebec to reduce the availablity of oil in that market,.
 

Butler1000

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Tourism does even compare to the magnitude of the trade deficit. If you take that 5x multiplier, the U.S. trade deficit works the other way in dampening activity.

If you looking back at this thread, you're trying to come up with ways that Canada can hurt the U.S. I'm not sure there is much Canada can do because the U.S. is looking at a much bigger global problem than just some tourism dollars.
The so called trade deficits with Canada is mostly energy based. Which you need.
 
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Frankfooter

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Tourism does even compare to the magnitude of the trade deficit. If you take that 5x multiplier, the U.S. trade deficit works the other way in dampening activity.

If you looking back at this thread, you're trying to come up with ways that Canada can hurt the U.S. I'm not sure there is much Canada can do because the U.S. is looking at a much bigger global problem than just some tourism dollars.
CBC notes that american companies are just eating the tariffs for now, GM didn't increase prices and lost $1 billion. That's not sustainable, likely companies were seeing if they could ride out the TACO king.

 
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squeezer

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The orange POS is now thinking about sending Americans' rebate cheques because of all the tax money he's taking in. I'm sure they will be stamped with Trump's fugly face on them. It will be akin to the Carbon Tax Rebate, so maga righties and pretzels be warned, bragging about this policy if the Trumputin Admin brings it in while railing against the carbon tax rebate. ;)

Tariff rebate check: What Trump said and what we know


 

Frankfooter

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Apr 10, 2015
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The orange POS is now thinking about sending Americans' rebate cheques because of all the tax money he's taking in. I'm sure they will be stamped with Trump's fugly face on them. It will be akin to the Carbon Tax Rebate, so maga righties and pretzels be warned, bragging about this policy if the Trumputin Admin brings it in while railing against the carbon tax rebate. ;)

Tariff rebate check: What Trump said and what we know


Isn't it shitty when politicians running massive deficits try to buy voters favour?
Ontario Providing Taxpayers with $200 Rebate
 

onthebottom

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CBC notes that american companies are just eating the tariffs for now, GM didn't increase prices and lost $1 billion. That's not sustainable, likely companies were seeing if they could ride out the TACO king.

GM has announced what their response is.


General Motors (GM) is investing $4 billion to shift some vehicle production back to the United States from Mexico. This move is partly in response to potential tariffs and aims to bring more manufacturing jobs to the US. The investment will affect plants in Michigan, Kansas, and Tennessee.
 
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