Guiliani slammed by firefighters

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WoodPeckr

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TOVisitor

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Don said:
Riiiiight...
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Care to engage me?

Let's start with Rudy. The FFs claim that he stupidly moved the command center to the WTC after the 1993 bombings.

Truth or fiction?
 
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markvee

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WoodPeckr said:
The present field of GOP candidates is pathetic to say the least.
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What is pathetic about GOP candidate Ron Paul?

He certainly is not an apologist for the current administration. He was against going into Iraq from the outset and is in favour of an immediate withdrawal.

From: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ron_Paul
wiki said:
Ronald Ernest Paul (born August 20, 1935) is a 10th-term Congressman from Lake Jackson, Texas, a member of the Republican Party, a physician, and a candidate for the 2008 presidential election. He has represented Texas's 14th congressional district in the U.S. House of Representatives since 1997 and represented Texas's 22nd district in 1976 and from 1979 to 1985. He earned the nickname "Dr. No" because he is a medical doctor who votes against any bill he believes violates the Constitution. On March 12, 2007, Paul announced his candidacy for the 2008 presidential election seeking the nomination of the Republican Party. Ron

Paul's political positions are largely in line with his stance as a libertarian, Constitutionalist, and non-interventionist. He is an advocate of freer trade, fewer taxes, smaller government, greater individual rights, and stronger national sovereignty.

In Congress, Paul has distinguished himself by his strict and sometimes unpopular adherence to small government conservative and libertarian principles. He has never voted to raise taxes or congressional pay and refuses to participate in the congressional pension system or take government-paid junkets.

Paul's medical training was interrupted when he was drafted during the Vietnam War into the United States Air Force. He served as a flight surgeon at Kelly Air Force Base in San Antonio, Texas from 1963 to 1965. He then served in the Air National Guard from 1965 to 1968 while completing his medical residency in Pittsburgh.

Paul began his medical practice in Lake Jackson, Texas, as a specialist in obstetrics and gynecology, and has delivered more than 4,000 babies. He took over the practice of a retiring doctor and was busy as the only obstetrician and gynecologist in Brazoria County. Paul said of his time as a doctor, "I delivered forty to fifty babies a month and did a lot of surgery." Dr. Paul did not accept Medicare or Medicaid as a physician; instead, he would do the work for free or work at a greatly lowered payment or payment plan for needy patients.

Ron Paul's political positions are largely in line with his stance as a libertarian, Constitutionalist, and non-interventionist. He is an advocate of freer trade, fewer taxes, smaller government, greater individual rights, and stronger national sovereignty.

Paul has participated in all three nationally-televised candidate debates held thus far. His most prominent moment came during the May 15 GOP Presidential debate when the following exchange occurred with fellow Republican hopeful Rudy Giuliani:

PAUL: They attack us because we've been over there. We've been bombing Iraq for 10 years. We've been in the Middle East [for years]. I think [Ronald] Reagan was right. We don't understand the irrationality of Middle Eastern politics. Right now, we're building an embassy in Iraq that is bigger than the Vatican. We're building 14 permanent bases. What would we say here if China was doing this in our country or in the Gulf of Mexico? We would be objecting.

GIULIANI: That's really an extraordinary statement. That's an extraordinary statement, as someone who lived through the attack of September 11, that we invited the attack because we were attacking Iraq. I don't think I've heard that before, and I've heard some pretty absurd explanations for September 11th. And I would ask the congressman to withdraw that comment and tell us that he didn't really mean that.

PAUL: I believe very sincerely that the CIA is correct when they teach and talk about blowback. When we went into Iran in 1953 and installed the Shah, yes there was blowback. The reaction to that was the taking of our hostages, and that persists. And if we ignore that, we ignore that at our own risk. If we think we can do what we want around the world and not incite hatred, then we have a problem. They don't come here to attack us because we're rich and we're free, they come and attack us because we're over there.
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WoodPeckr

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markvee said:
What is pathetic about GOP candidate Ron Paul?

He certainly is not an apologist for the current administration. He was against going into Iraq from the outset and is in favour of an immediate withdrawal.

From: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ron_Paul
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OK, Ron Paul is an exception, kinda like a Ross Perot redux and mainstream 'corporate owned' GOPers are doing all they can to marginalize Ron and see he gets nowhere.
I like what Ron says but the GOP is looking for another 'donkey', like Dubya so Ron Paul will be kept in the background unless he fights like hell to be heard.....:(
 
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maxweber

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WoodPeckr said:
OK, Ron Paul is an exception, kinda like a Ross Perot redux and mainstream 'corporate owned' GOPers are doing all they can to marginalize Ron and see he gets nowhere.
I like what Ron says but the GOP is looking for another 'donkey', like Dubya so Ron Paul will be kept in the background unless he fights like hell to be heard.....:(
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He's the Republican Dennis Kucinich.

MW
 
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markvee

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Dennis Kucinich vs Ron Paul for the Presidency would be excellent. These two have a track record of voting on priniciple and also have opposite views on substantial issues.

The "corporate owned" elements of the Democrat and Repbulican parties won't be able to marginalize these candidates if people get membersihips to the parties and vote.

I hope that people don't give up to the "corporate owned" elements by allowing the choice to be Hillary Clinton vs Rudy Giuliani.
 
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Asterix

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Don said:
Just like the Swift Boat Vets For Truth, eh?
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Interesting you should mention that, because that's exactly the comparison the Guiliani campaign is now trying to make in firing back at the IAFF. Kind of odd when you consider how many Republicans actually liked the Swift Boat ads, so I'm not sure who he's expecting to gain points with by this approach. The other obvious difference being that the firefighters have a clear advantage in credibility over those guys that attacked Kerry. 9/11 is everything for Guiliani. He loses his luster of leadership surrounding this and he's got nothing. Probably not the smartest move to take on the true heroes in all this, the NYFD, and expect he's not going to get burned. I can't wait to see how that's going to play around the country. After watching the video he seems as guilty as a puppy sitting next to a pile of poop.
 
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