Police brutality @ Babylon Martini, during Pride ~ PLEASE READ

[freshbreath]

this email has started to circulate, and now appears on many blogs and such
it's about the owner of the famous Babylon Martini bar/club in the gay area

the email has begun to rile a lot of people up, but I can't help be critical of the authenticity of it as I read it
something just doesn't jive

anyway, give it a read and post your thoughts

http://www.anyagalkina.com/blog/index.php?p=62

also, google the man's name, and you can find pertinent comments on other forums and blogs

 

[Goober Mcfly]

It's on the internet, it must be true!

A couple of things:

This -> "i told them, how i had been in business for 11 years. i told them how 9 out of those 11 years we had never had a problem such as the one right now. and i told them this would probably be the last time my business would be open. and with everything happening right now, there would be no way i could afford to open up again. they had destroyed us." seems just a bit over-dramatic, doesn't it?

I highly doubt that 911 wouldn't send an ambulance without a police officer from a specific division to help someone in dire straits. And judging from the letter, he doesn't sound like he would have said "take your time" to the 911 operator.

I call shenanigans.

 

[Esco!]

As always there are 2 sides to every story

 

[Kurt]

I agree something sound fishy

I know things like this happen but

It wouldn't be Police shutting him down it would have been the fire department and even it was the Police they would not have been undercover or plainclothed as he put it.

If this was remotely true these offices in question would be in deep s*&t. Especially with the new chief and how he is trying to change the publics perception of the Police in general.

I personally don't believe his account of this at all.

Would love to know the true story.

Just FYI the Fire Prevention Officer (Marshal) has shut down a plant I was working at.

He walked in alone.
Showed us his ID and Badge.
Asked us turn off all the machine and empty the factory floor.
We had three violations.
If we had refused he would have fined us thats it.
I don't know how it works for bars but this is my exp.

Kurt

 

[TheNiteHwk]

I find the whole story very hard to take. And I don't feel sorry for this guy at all. Sounds to me like he provoked the police right from the very start. Why did he have to go on the PA system and tell everybody that his business was being destroyed forever etc… what just over being closed for one night he has to shut his business down forever? He was trying to provoke the crowd to take up a fight for him. And if they did assault him at all it was only after he threw something at them. And then the next day he needed to go to the hospital... OK I can see that. But if he could stay at home for hours waiting then it could not have been that bad. And what a businessman with so many friends in the community could not get a ride to the hospital? BS... he is trying to make a mountain out of an anthill. His whole goal in this IMO is to sue somebody for financial gain. He doesn’t in my books have a leg to stand on. And that is putting it lightly. If you ask me straight up what I think… He is full of shit.

 

[TheNiteHwk]

'Contempt of Cop' always gets you into trouble. The guy went hysterical, insulted the police and threw something. Not good, and now he's paying the price. His statement is full of bullshit and fervour.

Exactly. I agree 100%. And IMO that is exactly what he is trying to do now with his e-mail etc. He is trying to garner support from others who have ‘contempt of cops.’ He might be very able to do that too. I say that because most people who do have ‘contempt of cops’ are not capable of being objective. In their minds the cops are wrong no matter what they do. He knows this and is trying to play it. Case in point… I showed this to someone else I know who hates cops. Right away the cop put-downs were being sounded. I also say this because I have been there myself years ago. I hated the cops. They could do no right ever. I had many contacts with the law from the wrong side of the law, as some would put it. And I was treated accordingly. Now a days I am a completely different person. If ever I have contact with the police I act polite, easy going and professional. And I always get the same in return. 100%. The guy like I said before… is full of shit.

 

[Bobzilla]

He also said that after he had shut down the 2nd & 3rd floors was the first time any of them showed a badge & at his request. Does he really expect us to believe that he shut down two floors of his nightclub without asking to see a badge? That he did this when they could have been anybody? Try again, buddy!

 

[TheNiteHwk]

He also said that after he had shut down the 2nd & 3rd floors was the first time any of them showed a badge & at his request. Does he really expect us to believe that he shut down two floors of his nightclub without asking to see a badge? That he did this when they could have been anybody? Try again, buddy!

Yah... LMAO.

I think I'll try it and see. Tonight I'll get a couple of football player type built guys and walk into The Rail and tell them they are over crowded. (which I am sure they will be) and tell them they have to close down. Not show them any ID or anything and then see what happens....

On second thought.... LMAO.

 

[solitaria]

Personally I think it is reasonable to assume the story probably could have some merit to it if it indeed was written by the owner of Babylon Martini. It doesn't sound that far fetched, he sounds very angry and usually you don't write something in that great of detail with so much emotion for kicks especially if he's been in business for 11 years and would have a better understanding of the consequences that such claims might mean to his reputation if proved false. If he was pissed solely on the account that he was shut down, then it would have been better to play only the race/gay card then to make a bunch of shit up about police brutality and the conversation/checkup he had with a forensics officer at 52 division substantiating his claims to a degree which is verifiable and easily unproven if untrue. Obviously the guy is prone to exaggeration (5 or 6 guys on average 300lbs and the extent of his assault and injuries - it couldn't be that bad if there were no broken bones, internal bleeding or stitches involved) but I wouldn't be surprised if there was some collective abuse of power on the part of those cops who no doubt were probably enjoying humiliating him for whatever reason. It would be interesting to hear their side of the story though like others have said before assuming anything past the story might have some merit to it.

 

[solitaria]

Yah... LMAO.

I think I'll try it and see. Tonight I'll get a couple of football player type built guys and walk into The Rail and tell them they are over crowded. (which I am sure they will be) and tell them they have to close down. Not show them any ID or anything and then see what happens....

On second thought.... LMAO.

It could be true if you view it from the cultural mindset of a middle-eastern family not the skepticism of a North American. The point is that you can't dismiss anyone or cast doubt on any one side without hearing more of the story. There have been lots of abuse of power by Cops.

 

[TheNiteHwk]

Personally I think it is reasonable to assume the story probably could have some merit to it if it indeed was written by the owner of Babylon Martini. It doesn't sound that far fetched, he sounds very angry and usually you don't write something in that great of detail with so much emotion for kicks especially if he's been in business for 11 years and would have a better understanding of the consequences that such claims might mean to his reputation if proved false. If he was pissed solely on the account that he was shut down, then it would have been better to play only the race/gay card then to make a bunch of shit up about police brutality and the conversation/checkup he had with a forensics officer at 52 division substantiating his claims to a degree which is verifiable and easily unproven if untrue. Obviously the guy is prone to exaggeration (5 or 6 guys on average 300lbs and the extent of his assault and injuries - it couldn't be that bad if there were no broken bones, internal bleeding or stitches involved) but I wouldn't be surprised if there was some collective abuse of power on the part of those cops who no doubt were probably enjoying humiliating him for whatever reason. It would be interesting to hear their side of the story though like others have said before assuming anything past the story might have some merit to it.

It's all about $$$ IMO...


OK... I'm not trying to say that there is no truth at all to what he is saying. So maybe the cops were a little over zealous or whatever. IMO he was asking for it right from the start though. OK... I mean there is always a grain of truth to every story like this. But this guy is now blowing it out of proportion... just like he did when the cops were there and play the public for support. Why did he get on his PA system and start crying victim? He should have just made a professional announcement that they were closing and ask people to leave. He was being an idiot and the cops told him so. What's wrong with that? Why could he have not when they came and said he was over crowded just simply in a polite and professional manner say 'Oh... OK etc" No he blew his top. Not a good decision. Now he has to close the bar forever. BS. I'll bet if you go by there right now he is wide open for business. Skillfully playing the crowd for support and of course $$$ in his pocket. Like I said IMO he is full of it. It's all about the money period. That and of course he wants the charges dropped. He's a player... get over it.

 

[WhaWhaWha]

He was wrong on all counts -- overloading his club irresponsibly, staging a confrontation, aggravating an already tense situation instead of quietly cooperating, and finally casting blame back on the police for his own actions.

Instead of accepting his penalty he resorted to accusations. He provoked the cops who are only human. so they lost it. I hope the officers threats to make it their life's mission to fuck him comes true. It would be nice to see him closed down and replaced with a law abiding tavern owner.

Still, can you blame him for trying? Look at the average police department. The racial diversity never reflects the community it serves. Tokens here and there. After all, Police corruption and misconduct are not hard to imagine.
It's in the news:

====
Police botched computer project: auditor
Last updated Jun 14 2005 08:49 AM EDT / CBC News
Toronto's auditor general says a police database project that went $10 million over budget was woefully mismanaged.
...
====
Four Toronto police officers face 26 charges
CTV.ca News Staff

The son of a former Toronto Police chief is one of four cops facing 26 criminal charges. The indictments were announced as part of an investigation into alleged police corruption in the Ontario capital.
...
Arising from an "ongoing RCMP-led organized crime investigation...
26 criminal charges have been laid against four... officers...
The accused officers are William McCormack Jr., the son of former chief William McCormack; former Toronto Police Association president Rick McIntosh; George Kouroudis and Jody Watson.

In April, William McCormack Jr., who works as a plainclothes cop in Toronto's entertainment district, was suspended with pay over his alleged involvement in shakedowns in some of the city's bars.
...
====
April 18, 2004 TorontoSun/CANOE
Toronto Cop Extorted payoffs at clubs?
...
====
Documents detail Toronto drug squad corruption
Last Updated Tue, 20 Jan 2004 10:45:55
TORONTO - Police corruption may have extended beyond the six Toronto drug squad officers at the centre of the largest investigation into police corruption in Canadian history, according to court documents released Monday.
...

 

[lick_a_lot]

I smell BS...and not a slide

OK being a former bartender in a downtown bar, I am far too familiar with the plainclothes cops and there charges... I will however admit all of the charges had merit... we had f-ed up to make more money. As one of them put it to me once you played the game and its your turn to pay.

The AGCO always has the final say and rules around liquor service are very stern, and for good reasons. One thing about the artical I find hard to swallow is this whinner's use or racial motivation. It seems to me every time someone screws up these days that isn't white its a right to claim race as a factor.

Cops are many things but in this day and age in a over packed bar full of witness' do you really think the fuzz is dumb enough to mock a minority.

Furthermore, they asked them to leave ... they have owned the bar for 11 years ... they know the rules. TIME TO GO. Don't battle it right there the cops don't want to hear it in a packed bar.. I think they have other concerns at that moment ... llike the angry mob!!

We have a court system in this country for a reason to launch a response to charges laid.

 

[Bobzilla]

It could be true if you view it from the cultural mindset of a middle-eastern family not the skepticism of a North American. The point is that you can't dismiss anyone or cast doubt on any one side without hearing more of the story. There have been lots of abuse of power by Cops.

I have no doubt that there's a kernel of truth in there somewhere, but I'd be willing to bet it's highly exaggerated.

As far as North Americans being skeptical??? I don't know about that. There's a lot of wackos in N. America who believe in Scientology, just to mention one example. Look at it another way; these people are from Iran originally, don't you think that they're maybe too quick to assume "abuse of power" because of that?

 

[holden]

There is no excuse for police brutality, the guy was in the wrong but that's no excuse for cops to beat him if the story is true

 

[Bobzilla]

There is no excuse for police brutality, the guy was in the wrong but that's no excuse for cops to beat him if the story is true

Uh...ALLEGED police brutality. You can bet that if this had been proven, it would be all over the news. This guy has obviously exaggerated what actually happened.

 

[The Shake]

Has anyone been able to verify that this even happened? Or, more to the point, that the owner of this bar actually composed the e-mail?

I did a search and I could only find the alleged e-mail and bloggers editorializing about it. I have yet to see a single post (here or elsewhere) that indicates that anyone has even called the alleged victim to confirm that the incident occurred, let alone the police.

 

[The Shake]

Has anyone been able to verify that this even happened? Or, more to the point, that the owner of this bar actually composed the e-mail?

I did a search and I could only find the alleged e-mail and bloggers editorializing about it. I have yet to see a single post (here or elsewhere) that indicates that anyone has even called the alleged victim to confirm that the incident occurred, let alone the police.

Looks like it is a real story:

from http://mychol.com/

Babylon UPDATE

I've just spent almost an hour on the phone with Amir, trying to piece together the events that transpired at Babylon. I have encouraged him to file a formal complaint with the Police Services Board and to pursue it as thoroughly as possible.

I am going to try to meet with Amir in person later this evening to assist him with processing what has happened. In addition to these journal entries, I intend to prepare as complete a narrative of events as possible in an effort to get the word out about this appalling situation. Regular media outlets refuse to cover the story, for reasons not immediately apparent (although we can speculate why they might be reluctant to cover a story that appears on the surface to be a racially-motivated hate crime perpetrated by a handful of "Toronto's finest").

 

[Bobzilla]

from http://mychol.com/
Regular media outlets refuse to cover the story, for reasons not immediately apparent (although we can speculate why they might be reluctant to cover a story that appears on the surface to be a racially-motivated hate crime perpetrated by a handful of "Toronto's finest").

Shake, I understand that you didn't write this, it's the dude on the site you provided, but I disagree that regular media wouldn't want to report this. They'd be all over this kind of stuff, IMO, especially the Sun. The Hamilton Spectator reports allegations of police wrongdoing all the time, I doubt the Toronto papers would forbear from doing this. Personally, I think it's because no formal complaint or lawsuit has been filed.

Bet the farm that if this isn't done, the guy's story is just that, a story. Even if a complaint/lawsuit is filed, it won't be proven until a judge or the board the cops use for investigations agrees with it.

 

[solitaria]

Instead of accepting his penalty he resorted to accusations. He provoked the cops who are only human. so they lost it. I hope the officers threats to make it their life's mission to fuck him comes true. It would be nice to see him closed down and replaced with a law abiding tavern owner.

Wow. That's pretty ignorant. Yes, yes wouldn't our society be better off if cops let their personal vendettas get in the way of objectively applying the law. If the cop really did say that and it can be collaborated by witnesses then he should be kicked off the force.