Black Panther and the supposed need for idols

[omegaphallic]

Although gross sales are a nice indicator, between inflation and the addition of 3-D, D-Box, etc., the dollar value earned is skewed. The fair comparison which isn't shown is #tickets sold.

I love superhero movies although Iron Man 3 was crap and Age of Ultron was ok. 20 min into Deadpool I turned it off, and although I liked Dr. Strange it didn't do so well.

But back to the topic/question, why is the author of this article hosting a free showing for this movie? Did he do the same for Iron Man or Captain America?

Deadpool was fucking hillarilious, tied with Black Panther as my favourite Superhero movie.

Actually I don't even really think of Black Panther as a Superhero movie, more a general sci-fi political intrigue movie.

I mean if you watched Black Panther and didn't know it was tied to the Avengers universe, you likely would think of T'Challa as a powerful King, more then a Superhero. Being a Superhero is more what Black Panther does when a weird ass crisis hits, not the core of the character, being King of Wakanda is the core feature of the character.

Anyways it sucks that SJW have to ruin the movie for people, why can't people just fucking enjoying it in fucking peace without the joy vampires draining every last shred of fun from it.

 

[omegaphallic]

Black Panther has made over $900 million dollars so far. It cist $200 million to make. It will hit over a billion dollars. And it did it during the winter.

 

[D-Fens]

I don't disagree that brown people are stereotyped on the screen, as are East Asian people. Same is true of French, British, or pretty much any person who has a thick, noticeable accent and/or looks different. And while in some cases it's funny when that is the goal, in other cases it does a huge disservice to that particular race because it keeps re-enforcing stereotypes to the point where people sometimes make stupid jokes at your expense and your reply is "really, you think that's true?" I personally think Bollywood does a HUGE disservice to EI people as the majority of movies have the same type of characters. If Bollywood were to produce more content that is dramatic, removes the dancing and cheap jokes, people would perhaps see EI's in a different light (I know some movies are made but it's a small percentage).

I'll give you this. Having movies where the main character isn't stereotypical white guy is great for white people to open their eyes. I'll fully admit that some white people need exposure to a variety of ethnicities and need a little education. So having these types of characters is great for that reason.

I watched Luke Cage and enjoyed it. I'm not black. I didn't feel this barrier when it comes to relating to him. I watched Jessica Jones. I'm not a woman. Same thing - no issue with respect to relating or needing to relate.

I wouldn't call Bollywood a disservice to EI people. Yes there are a lot of terrible bollywood films with silly plots, bad acting, and cheesy singing and dancing. but if the US had a population the same size as India they would produce just as many terrible movies. Bollywood is a country of a billion people with dozens of different languages. Movies are made in hindi, movies are made in urdu, gujrati, telgu, and so fourth. They have to cater to different demographics and cultures. and not every movie is going to be a cinematic masterpiece.

That being said There are A LOT of bollywood films that potray EI people in a positive light. Where the acting and stories are top notch and the song and dance are beautiful. Films like Virasat, Lagaan, Macchis, and Bombay are just a few of many examples of extremely well made Bollywood Cinema. Especially recently in the last decade or so there have been a lot of very well made Bollywood movies. Some of my favorites being, Dhobi Ghat, Company, (a really good bollywood gangster flick that potrays life in the Mumbai underworld and films about the Indian Mafia aren't exactly common) Sultan, Hungama, Rang De Be Santi I could go on The talent is there and the quality is there Yes the song and dance is still there. but that is a staple of the bollywood cinema experience. and it doesn't take away from the good acting and storytelling of these films. So No, I don't believe bollywood is a disservice to EI people In Bollywood I get to see heroes who look like me. Men who are strong, sexy, playing well written characters. Because I know Hollywood is not going to do it. They will continue to potray me as a nerdy sidekick, terrorist, doctor or some other boring two dimensional sterotypical character.

Yeah, I enjoy Luke Cage. and Jessica Jones to. I'm not saying you have to be the same race or gender as the main characters to enjoy these films, that's silly. I just enjoy it even more if the character looks like me. I can connect even more with him. For you the barrier may not be there but for me it is.

 

[sempel]

I wouldn't call Bollywood a disservice to EI people. Yes there are a lot of terrible bollywood films with silly plots, bad acting, and cheesy singing and dancing. but if the US had a population the same size as India they would produce just as many terrible movies. Bollywood is a country of a billion people with dozens of different languages. Movies are made in hindi, movies are made in urdu, gujrati, telgu, and so fourth. They have to cater to different demographics and cultures. and not every movie is going to be a cinematic masterpiece.

That being said There are A LOT of bollywood films that potray EI people in a positive light. Where the acting and stories are top notch and the song and dance are beautiful. Films like Virasat, Lagaan, Macchis, and Bombay are just a few of many examples of extremely well made Bollywood Cinema. Especially recently in the last decade or so there have been a lot of very well made Bollywood movies. Some of my favorites being, Dhobi Ghat, Company, (a really good bollywood gangster flick that potrays life in the Mumbai underworld and films about the Indian Mafia aren't exactly common) Sultan, Hungama, Rang De Be Santi I could go on The talent is there and the quality is there Yes the song and dance is still there. but that is a staple of the bollywood cinema experience. and it doesn't take away from the good acting and storytelling of these films. So No, I don't believe bollywood is a disservice to EI people In Bollywood I get to see heroes who look like me. Men who are strong, sexy, playing well written characters. Because I know Hollywood is not going to do it. They will continue to potray me as a nerdy sidekick, terrorist, doctor or some other boring two dimensional sterotypical character.

Yeah, I enjoy Luke Cage. and Jessica Jones to. I'm not saying you have to be the same race or gender as the main characters to enjoy these films, that's silly. I just enjoy it even more if the character looks like me. I can connect even more with him. For you the barrier may not be there but for me it is.

Yes, Bollywood is changing and in some cases there are great films. The problem is when you mix good performance with cheap plot and music, the impression taken away is not the performance. Take a straw poll about people's impression of Bollywood and the majority will have the stereotypical impression, even though to your point, that doesn't tell the whole story and there are films that aren't stereotypical.

I agree with your last paragraph but it seems other people don't. I understand Hollywood having a negative impression about lead characters who don't fit the mold so BP and WW are proof that success is achievable. So I'm glad that we will see more movies like them because they are bankable. But them not being made has been no impact on me either because I don't believe that being able to relate based on race (or gender) takes away from my ability to idolize and enjoy.

 

[Fathammer]

Black Panther has made over $900 million dollars so far. It cist $200 million to make. It will hit over a billion dollars. And it did it during the winter.

The numbers are hypothetical at best.

They could tell you they made whatever they want.

If they told you it made 2 million in its first 2 weeks, nobody would go and it would be labeled a flop.

Sometimes inflating numbers gives suggestion that its actually making money so it draws crowds to actually make the money they say.

Its the old, "talk about it enough and curiosity will have them running to see it" scenario.

I personally dont think the numbers are acurate. Many theaters in the USA are saying the white customers are being threatened and beaten up because they're at "The wrong movie, whitey".

 

[D-Fens]

Yes, Bollywood is changing and in some cases there are great films. The problem is when you mix good performance with cheap plot and music, the impression taken away is not the performance. Take a straw poll about people's impression of Bollywood and the majority will have the stereotypical impression, even though to your point, that doesn't tell the whole story and there are films that aren't stereotypical.

I agree with your last paragraph but it seems other people don't. I understand Hollywood having a negative impression about lead characters who don't fit the mold so BP and WW are proof that success is achievable. So I'm glad that we will see more movies like them because they are bankable. But them not being made has been no impact on me either because I don't believe that being able to relate based on race (or gender) takes away from my ability to idolize and enjoy.

It's not cheap. Bollywood is known for creating the best music and dance sequences in movies. They know how to do dance and music better then anyone It's also a big part of the culture. Yes there are lots of bad Bollywood movies, just like there are plenty of terrible Hollywood movies . There is just happens to be more bad Bollywood movies because they have four times the population. So they make more movies So of course there be more bad movies as well. You call it cheap because you're not Indian. You don't understand the culture. You didn't grow up with the song and dance. I did. and for us it is beautiful. and for many it does not take away the experience. Infact it is an integral part of the movie. I am not sure which polls you are talking about. But the fact is. Bollywood does not make movies for people like you. They make movies for their audiences. Just like Hollywood makes movies for their audiences. I'm sure if you did the same polls in India they would all think Hollywood movies are all about sex.

 

[exnocomment]

Weird that there are some people that seem to feel threatened by Black Panthers success?

The Brazilian box office numbers of $25M for example should indicate to you how desperate some people are to see someone that they think looks even somewhat like them (culturally). I’m a pretty successful minority and the lack of role models growing up was definitely a thing even though I’m not African American.

I think it is constantly shocking to me how bad people are about being able to remove themselves from their own lived experience. This attitude shows up everywhere including politics - my own experience must be reality right? We need less empathy and less confidence and more cold hard logic and rationality.

 

[Insidious Von]

Ravishing Rose Leslie returns with her third highly acclaimed show The Good Fight. I was surprised that the show held my interest from the get go. It's a lawyer's dramedy fronted by two very talented character actors: Christine Batanski and Delroy Lindo. At the end of S1, Maia Rindell (Leslie) gets arrested for being an accomplice in her Bernie Maedoff like father's crimes. He goes awol. Lucca Quinn (Cush Jumbo) becomes her defense attorney. With S2, Jane Lynch (Glee) is the prosecutor. The show starts off with a tense powerplay featuring the leads. To take the edge off, the wake's bartender offers Diane Lockhart (Baranski) magic mushrooms extract.

On second viewing of Black Panther, I noticed something that I'm sure director Ryan Coogler did purposefully. The film has two Forest Whitakers, FW himself and Winston Duke as M'Baku. The role is something that Forest Whitaker would have relished as a younger man. A very shrewd move, FW is he reason I watched the film in the first place.

The only good scene from Martin Scorsese's worst film. If Tomasina had played an openly gay man, it would have worked. Martino must have hated the boot licking.

 

[Butler1000]

Huge fan of Marvel here. Saw it yesterday. I really don't care about the PC.

The movie IMO ranks in the middle of the pack. Decent story( basically brother vs brother but extended). Some of the visuals were fantastic. Others were not executed well. Actors were uniformly good to better.

Loved the role of the sister but felt they went over the top in her abilities. No way at her young age could she have created and then build the trams as an example. Not the size of the network they protrayed.

Anyway this sets up Avengers 3. And the previous twenty films are all set up for it and Avengers 4.

 

[frankcastle]

Huge fan of Marvel here. Saw it yesterday. I really don't care about the PC.

The movie IMO ranks in the middle of the pack. Decent story( basically brother vs brother but extended). Some of the visuals were fantastic. Others were not executed well. Actors were uniformly good to better.

Loved the role of the sister but felt they went over the top in her abilities. No way at her young age could she have created and then build the trams as an example. Not the size of the network they protrayed.

Anyway this sets up Avengers 3. And the previous twenty films are all set up for it and Avengers 4.

Wow. Middle of the pack? What are your top choices?

For me I'd say the top marvel movies would be winter soldier, ant man, black pather, guardians..... with the rest tied for 5th. Still have to see Ragnarok.

 

[frankcastle]

The numbers are hypothetical at best.

They could tell you they made whatever they want.

If they told you it made 2 million in its first 2 weeks, nobody would go and it would be labeled a flop.

Sometimes inflating numbers gives suggestion that its actually making money so it draws crowds to actually make the money they say.

Its the old, "talk about it enough and curiosity will have them running to see it" scenario.

I personally dont think the numbers are acurate. Many theaters in the USA are saying the white customers are being threatened and beaten up because they're at "The wrong movie, whitey".

If they were fake numbers wouldn't a rival film company want to expose that?

Also, wouldn't Disney share holders be upset if those numbers were inflated?

 

[Insidious Von]

I haven't seen too many Marvel films lately, they tend to all blend into each other. I was noticeably underwhelmed by Deadpool, mind numbing CGI and didn't think much of Ryan Reynolds smarmy take on the role. Avengers 3 may not be that successful, too many characters. After the success of Jumanji, Nebula was included. It will be too cluttered.

Black Panther is racking it in because it's fresh and different. It gave me the same thrill I got when I saw Raiders of the Lost Ark for the first time. One major hurdle cleared, the next one will come in October. Venom will be MCU's first true R Rated film, kudos to them for backing the project completely.

 

[Insidious Von]

DC's I Zombie is coming back for another season. Sexy Rose McIver has shown some big chops taking on so many different roles.

Kinda gives me a craving for lamb's brain.

 

[sempel]

It's not cheap. Bollywood is known for creating the best music and dance sequences in movies. They know how to do dance and music better then anyone It's also a big part of the culture. Yes there are lots of bad Bollywood movies, just like there are plenty of terrible Hollywood movies . There is just happens to be more bad Bollywood movies because they have four times the population. So they make more movies So of course there be more bad movies as well. You call it cheap because you're not Indian. You don't understand the culture. You didn't grow up with the song and dance. I did. and for us it is beautiful. and for many it does not take away the experience. Infact it is an integral part of the movie. I am not sure which polls you are talking about. But the fact is. Bollywood does not make movies for people like you. They make movies for their audiences. Just like Hollywood makes movies for their audiences. I'm sure if you did the same polls in India they would all think Hollywood movies are all about sex.

I'm not saying it is cheap, dollar-wise, but cheap plot means what it means - no creativity, just recycling similar storylines. I've seen 10 movies where the plot/characters are so similar everything is predictable.

I'm not trying to shit on Bollywood. To your point, it's mainly for the Indian audience, it's traditional/culture, and yes there are some really great movies. The only thing I'm saying though is people I know in all walks of life here have a stereotypical impression of EI's based on Bollywood movies. Whether it takes more non-traditional movies or better promotion of the few that are made, people in NA in many cases start out with a stereotypical impression.

Weird that there are some people that seem to feel threatened by Black Panthers success?

The Brazilian box office numbers of $25M for example should indicate to you how desperate some people are to see someone that they think looks even somewhat like them (culturally). I’m a pretty successful minority and the lack of role models growing up was definitely a thing even though I’m not African American.

I think it is constantly shocking to me how bad people are about being able to remove themselves from their own lived experience. This attitude shows up everywhere including politics - my own experience must be reality right? We need less empathy and less confidence and more cold hard logic and rationality.

I don't think anyone's threatened by it. Don't see a bunch of KKK members protesting or anything like that.

Ravishing Rose Leslie returns with her third highly acclaimed show The Good Fight. I was surprised that the show held my interest from the get go. It's a lawyer's dramedy fronted by two very talented character actors: Christine Batanski and Delroy Lindo. At the end of S1, Maia Rindell (Leslie) gets arrested for being an accomplice in her Bernie Maedoff like father's crimes. He goes awol. Lucca Quinn (Cush Jumbo) becomes her defense attorney. With S2, Jane Lynch (Glee) is the prosecutor. The show starts off with a tense powerplay featuring the leads. To take the edge off, the wake's bartender offers Diane Lockhart (Baranski) magic mushrooms extract.

On second viewing of Black Panther, I noticed something that I'm sure director Ryan Coogler did purposefully. The film has two Forest Whitakers, FW himself and Winston Duke as M'Baku. The role is something that Forest Whitaker would have relished as a younger man. A very shrewd move, FW is he reason I watched the film in the first place.

The only good scene from Martin Scorsese's worst film. If Tomasina had played an openly gay man, it would have worked. Martino must have hated the boot licking.

The Good Fight is a great sequel to the Good Wife and Christine Baranski and Delroy Lindo are great. Rose Leslie is ok.

Huge fan of Marvel here. Saw it yesterday. I really don't care about the PC.

The movie IMO ranks in the middle of the pack. Decent story( basically brother vs brother but extended). Some of the visuals were fantastic. Others were not executed well. Actors were uniformly good to better.

Loved the role of the sister but felt they went over the top in her abilities. No way at her young age could she have created and then build the trams as an example. Not the size of the network they protrayed.

Anyway this sets up Avengers 3. And the previous twenty films are all set up for it and Avengers 4.

Also a huge fan too and have yet to see BP. But saw WW (I know it's DC) and I think it was average to good. I remember when it hit theatres and the reviews were out of this world like your life would be changed watching it. To me it was decent enough.

Wow. Middle of the pack? What are your top choices?

For me I'd say the top marvel movies would be winter soldier, ant man, black pather, guardians..... with the rest tied for 5th. Still have to see Ragnarok.

Most of the movies are middle of the pack - entertaining enough so you see them in the theatres but your mind isn't blown away. Just saw Ragnarok and it's in the middle (lower part).

I don't know if one is better than the rest but Avengers, Iron Man 1, Captain America 1 and 2, and Ant Man are up there. Thor 2, Iron Man 2 and 3 (except for Ben Kingsley) were definitely written in 30 minutes and approved. Yet to see Black Panther so not sure where it ranks but I have a suspicion that it's overhyped.

I haven't seen too many Marvel films lately, they tend to all blend into each other. I was noticeably underwhelmed by Deadpool, mind numbing CGI and didn't think much of Ryan Reynolds smarmy take on the role. Avengers 3 may not be that successful, too many characters. After the success of Jumanji, Nebula was included. It will be too cluttered.

Agree wholeheartedly about Deadpool. I guess some people like that Ryan Reynolds character type but I don't.

 

[Butler1000]

Wow. Middle of the pack? What are your top choices?

For me I'd say the top marvel movies would be winter soldier, ant man, black pather, guardians..... with the rest tied for 5th. Still have to see Ragnarok.

Without actualky trying to assign individual numbers.....

Top tier for me us Avengers 1, Guardians 1, Iron man 1 and all three Captain America.

Next is Dr. Strange, Thor 3(lot of fun)

Then it's Black Panther, Guardians 2, Thor 1 2, Antman.

Iron man 2 and 3 shouldn't have been made. Not with those stories.

I'm a huge fan. And old reader. There is probably bias due to my love of the Avengers and Cap. But that also I think gave me a critical eye for fucking it up.

 

[Butler1000]

As an aside on Deadpool like or hate the movie he captured the character and tone if the comic perfectly. It's fine to say you didn't like the smarmy and 4th wall breaking but that is exactly what the character is.

Hopefully Disney won't try to PG him. This franchise has at least two more movies in it( one in the can) and can make money. That and Logan proved you can tell an adult comic movie(And there are alot of adult storied out there)

 

[Insidious Von]

The 4th wall breaking was the best part of the film, but Deadpool was too juvenile for my liking. Logan is in my top 3 of my best films of 2017, Patrick Stewart deserved a nomination - fuck The Academy.

I've yet to see any of the current crop break into the top three - check that 4 - of my favorites, Black Panther comes close. I looked up who's playing Thanos, Josh Brolin. Solid choice but I would have preferred Ralph Fiennes, more sinister.

The Dark Knight, Spiderman 2 (2004) and Darkman (Liam Neeson - 1990) and Logan.

darkman with current Best Actress winner Frances McDormand.

 

[Tony Figaro]

Admittedly, I was wrong and Disney's "A Wrinkle in Time" came in second at the box office behind BP. I really thought the newer Disney released movie was going to be able to dethrone the older Disney picture. Anyway, let's see if "Tomb Raider" will be able to do it next weekend? I really hope so since I'm seeing it opening weekend. LOL

 

[ClassyGent]

Where are all the Asian people saying "Our only idols are martial arts heroes, we need more Asian heroes?" Same thing with EI - as Sugar Sammy says, " Our mainstream media idol is Apu from the Simpsons".

Lots of Asian people were pissed off about the white washing of Asian characters in Dr. Strange, for one. Iron Fist got similar feedback. Outside of the superhero genre, recent examples like Ghost in the Shell and The Great Wall are pretty easy to find, and readily criticized by Asian film reviewers and the people of other ethnicities willing to see their perspective.

Just because you don't hear marginalized voices doesn't mean they don't exist; it actually just means you're part of the exact problem you're trying to be an authority on.

 

[Insidious Von]

No shame in that Signore Figaro, I earn my living forecasting. Disney always falters when it comes to original content. As for Tomb Raider, that's a pick em. Alicia Vikander is a better actor than Angelina Jolie. I've soured on Benedict Cumberbatch, he hitched his wagon to Harvey Weinstein's vision, Alan Turing ended up smelling like cheese. Disney has too much money invested in the PRC, that's why the Tibetan monk ended up becoming Tilda Swinton.

I've been waiting impatiently for The Death of Stalin to be released. Its been banned in Russia. It seems that the producers were waiting to see what sort of buzz Jason Isaacs would generate. CBS Access couldn't have asked for a better launch, Star Trek: Discovery exceeded expectations. Checking it's latest Metroscore, the diehards are beginning to embrace it.