Carney casts doubt on Canada securing a tariff-free deal with Trump

onthebottom

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So then GM shareholders, who are US consumers, will bear that cost. And probably workers, also US consumers, when contract negotiations come up.

As for the other 99 billion. It will be passed along. Walmart already has been raising prices. Then the small e-commerce retailers via Amazon and the like have done so, eaten some cost(and as they are also consumers, that money won't circulate), others are suspending, or closing up shop. Reducing or eliminating their consumers footprint.

It's all as you say, going into the US treasury. Right? You know, that place of waste and fraud and corruption.

Btw, the US tourism industry is expected to take a 90 billion hit, only about 12ish billion is international. Which means about 80 billion in lost domestic revenue circulation. Vegas in reporting a huge downturn. Florida is under an exodus.

Wait until the poor spending numbers by Christmas. The hurt hasn't really begun.
GM has already said they will address by moving more production to the US.
inflation is well under 3%
odds of a recession in the US have collapsed.

Deals done with UK, Indonesia, Philippines and Japan. Next up will be EU. China all but done.
 

Butler1000

Well-known member
Oct 31, 2011
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GM has already said they will address by moving more production to the US.
inflation is well under 3%
odds of a recession in the US have collapsed.

Deals done with UK, Indonesia, Philippines and Japan. Next up will be EU. China all but done.
Yes, with tariffs that will increase prices.

Seriously, do you think corporations will just eat the cost?

Im amazed you are for this sales tax.
 
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Mira

Member
Sep 24, 2005
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Can you see the ctv link or are you just in denial?
Doug Ford and Carney recently spent time together at Ford's cottage, Doug was quite impressed with the man and sincerely endorses his leadership. A surprising non-partisan response, but Doug's not so impressed with the Federal CPC leader it seems.
 
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Frankfooter

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Doug Ford and Carney recently spent time together at Ford's cottage, Doug was quite impressed with the man and sincerely endorses his leadership. A surprising non-partisan response, but Doug's not so impressed with the Federal CPC leader it seems.
DoFo is busy privatizing health care, defunding education and his new plan, selling off Wasaga beach to his donor buddies.
 

onthebottom

Never Been Justly Banned
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Yes, with tariffs that will increase prices.

Seriously, do you think corporations will just eat the cost?

Im amazed you are for this sales tax.
GM eat the cost. prices are set by market, not cost. GM can’t just mark up its full size pickup when they are competing with Ford (that has a larger US manufacturing footprint).
 

DesRicardo

aka Dick Dastardly
Dec 2, 2022
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Doug Ford and Carney recently spent time together at Ford's cottage, Doug was quite impressed with the man and sincerely endorses his leadership. A surprising non-partisan response, but Doug's not so impressed with the Federal CPC leader it seems.
Doug ford only has a position because every other party in Ontario sucks. Nothing to boast about.
 

Butler1000

Well-known member
Oct 31, 2011
32,195
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GM eat the cost. prices are set by market, not cost. GM can’t just mark up its full size pickup when they are competing with Ford (that has a larger US manufacturing footprint).
Lol! You don't think they talk?

The cost will get passed on. I'm really amazed by your thoughts. Did the price gouge after the pandemic teach you nothing? Corporations have a responsibility first to shareholders remember? So they will raise prices, layoffs will occur, and lobbying to kill the tariffs in a few years will happen. And the public will have gotten used to the prices and so they won't lower them.

And that is the best case scenario.

I guess in our case we will have to just to surcharges on to oil and electricity.
 

Valcazar

Just a bundle of fucking sunshine
Mar 27, 2014
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I find it sad that you think the hard work should start now and that you won't admit that it should have been done during the first year of the genocide and the election.
People have been doing the hard work for decades. Dude.
I don't think it should "start now".
It started ages ago and is ongoing.

That you don't understand that is part of your problem.

We had this discussion through 2024 and not once did you think there should be any pressure to change the dems.
This is a change in direction from you.
I forgot.
You're completely delusional.
Everything that isn't "You agree with me totally in all ways about all tactics" is "You don't believe there should be any pressure".

trump was elected.
Denying that what you backed failed to win the election and that the largest protests since Floyd George might have impacted the election is magical thinking.
I've never once denied that they might have affected the election.
Everything affects an election.
We agree Trump got elected.
We disagreed about whether or not it would be a good thing.

Straw man argument, your specialty.
How can people have honest discussions with you when constantly use this tactic?
It's not my fault that you constantly say ridiculous things in sloppy ways?
But let's assume you actually wanted to say that your best hope of stopping what's going on in Gaza was to put pressure on Harris.
You failed.
Dramatically.
Your failure made things worse not just for other people but for Gaza.
You were told that was a the most likely result of your gamble.
You said anyone who pointed any of that out was morally culpable for genocide and valued American lives more than Palestinian ones.

If you honestly believed that the protests against Harris were your best chance, you would have argued differently as well, since you would have agreed that getting Trump elected meant you had blown your best chance.

The biggest chance for change over the last few years was riding the very massive and public protests against Biden's policy during 2024.
And that failed.
There were massive, public protests, and it didn't change the policy, it resulted --- according to you -- in getting Trump elected and making things worse and harder to fix.

You could argue that the dems have fallen apart and now would be a good time to rebuild them, if you were more interested in discussion than scoring points, but where is that pressure coming from now?
If I recall, you insisted it would happen magically.
They would lose and be forced to become anti-zionist to win elections in the future.
That was the pressure.
The Dems losing was explicitly part of your plan. Why are you worrying about where the pressure will come from now?
You had that figured out, remember?

Different issues.

Reform in the dems to back the more progressive policies that their voters back is possible, and now would be the time for the push for that to happen.
Reform from the Citizens United/plutocracy is less likely. But you might get someone who will push to replace some medicaid funding or another tax break on mortgages.
Why do you think those are different issues from "more progressive policy"?

I know your focus is on the best way to count the votes, but not on the systemic issues that are the real major problems.
That is a systemic issue, Frank.
Good lord.

Even now you appear to be arguing for the status quo and not change.
As in:

Of course you think this is about siding with MTG and not support of the genocide.
That's your own bias and a prime example of you backing partisanship over policy. You say you back reform then try to declare its not right to vote based on issues, just party.
No.
That is me making fun of you for you not understanding what you're talking about and just being led around the nose by xitter.

Interesting isn't it that its the right wing who elevated AOC and now Mandami? It shows how messed up the dems are that they are afraid of being identified with someone who backs policies the people back.
Not really.
The Dem Leadership has its problems, yes.
But the right wing elevating these people - just as they have elevated lots of others you would dislike - comes from their command over the media environment.

AOC has stood out by way of her ability to take advantage of the spotlight they gave her.
We will see if Mandami will be able to do the same.

More the fact that Huey Long is a sidenote to history, to the point where you felt you had to even ask if I knew who he was.
There are no left wing heroes in the US, are there? There would never be a Robin Hood type, give it to the poor, type hero. Just more and more 'eat the rich', Bonny and Clyde antiheroes.
Do you think Huey Long should be a left-wing hero?

If this is the chance for reform, who will lead the dems and push for what voters want?
Good question.
Which leader will get in front of the movement and channel it?
Which think they can weld this part of the coalition to the broader coalition and move forward with success?
Lots of people vying for the role in various ways.

A problem, of course, remains that the general voter is not the primary voter.
And that most voters don't vote on policy.
 

Frankfooter

dangling member
Apr 10, 2015
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People have been doing the hard work for decades. Dude.
I don't think it should "start now".
It started ages ago and is ongoing.

That you don't understand that is part of your problem.
During the election you said that was not the time to pressure the dems to do the hard work.
Now you say it is the time.
That is what we are talking about.

I forgot.
You're completely delusional.
Everything that isn't "You agree with me totally in all ways about all tactics" is "You don't believe there should be any pressure".
uh huh

I've never once denied that they might have affected the election.
Everything affects an election.
We agree Trump got elected.
We disagreed about whether or not it would be a good thing.
I never said it would be a good thing, don't lie.
You didn't think the dems responding to the massive, country wide protests against the genocide would effect the election, despite 70% of dems backing ceasefire.
You still don't think that the difference making number of dems who stayed home and didn't vote could have been influenced by the genocide.
That is our difference in opinion.

It's not my fault that you constantly say ridiculous things in sloppy ways?
But let's assume you actually wanted to say that your best hope of stopping what's going on in Gaza was to put pressure on Harris.
You failed.
Dramatically.
Your failure made things worse not just for other people but for Gaza.
You were told that was a the most likely result of your gamble.
You said anyone who pointed any of that out was morally culpable for genocide and valued American lives more than Palestinian ones.
Your memory is shitty or you are telling yourself stories to make yourself feel better.
I said any moral person who understand 'never again' could never vote for a leader who is actively aiding genocide.
You called this naive and said it was 'pragmatic' to vote for genocide to keep trump from winning and things getting bad in the US.
I argued that joining the massive amount of dems trying to stop Harris/Biden from aiding genocide would be needed for them to win the election.
You didn't, you thought it wouldn't effect the election.

If you honestly believed that the protests against Harris were your best chance, you would have argued differently as well, since you would have agreed that getting Trump elected meant you had blown your best chance.
In an election between genocide and genocide lite the genocide team will always win as some people won't vote for any form of genocide. The number of dems that stayed home made the difference.

Your plan failed, trump is in power.

And that failed.
There were massive, public protests, and it didn't change the policy, it resulted --- according to you -- in getting Trump elected and making things worse and harder to fix.
Your plan failed.
You said do nothing and the dems will win anyways.
You were wrong.

If I recall, you insisted it would happen magically.
They would lose and be forced to become anti-zionist to win elections in the future.
That was the pressure.
The Dems losing was explicitly part of your plan. Why are you worrying about where the pressure will come from now?
You had that figured out, remember?
Why do you think those are different issues from "more progressive policy"?
That is a systemic issue, Frank.
Good lord.
No.
That is me making fun of you for you not understanding what you're talking about and just being led around the nose by xitter.
Not really.
The Dem Leadership has its problems, yes.
But the right wing elevating these people - just as they have elevated lots of others you would dislike - comes from their command over the media environment.
AOC has stood out by way of her ability to take advantage of the spotlight they gave her.
We will see if Mandami will be able to do the same.
Do you think Huey Long should be a left-wing hero?
Good question.
Which leader will get in front of the movement and channel it?
Which think they can weld this part of the coalition to the broader coalition and move forward with success?
Lots of people vying for the role in various ways.

A problem, of course, remains that the general voter is not the primary voter.
And that most voters don't vote on policy.
We are past day 300 of the genocide and you are still spending your time and anger on me and dem voters who wouldn't vote for genocide.
You have never once said that the genocide is wrong, that Harris and Biden were wrong to support it.
You have never once noted that the genocide has destroyed zionism along with Gaza.
You have never noted that AIPAC is the one that has destroyed democracy and put trump in power.

You just want to blame me and the dems who honoured 'never again' by refusing to vote for genocide.
That is on you and all your zionist friends.
 

Valcazar

Just a bundle of fucking sunshine
Mar 27, 2014
37,016
74,448
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During the election you said that was not the time to pressure the dems to do the hard work.
Now you say it is the time.
That is what we are talking about.
I said your pressure campaign would likely fail and that you had no backup plan since the most likely outcome if you didn't get the Dems to move was to elect Trump.
I was correct. (And no, we haven't forgotten your constant insistence that Trump wouldn't be worse and anyone pointing out the damage he would do was a racist monster.)
The actual pressure campaign to move US policy on Israel has been decades long and will continue for years to come.

I never said it would be a good thing, don't lie.
Not lying.
If you want to deny your past, go right ahead.
It's the internet. Do what you want.

You didn't think the dems responding to the massive, country wide protests against the genocide would effect the election, despite 70% of dems backing ceasefire.
You still don't think that the difference making number of dems who stayed home and didn't vote could have been influenced by the genocide.
Why do you keep lying about what I think?
I have repeatedly pointed out that your "proof" of things doesn't hold up.
You have decided this means I don't believe anything had any effect.
This is a lot like richecag's whole "You criticized Trump's ICE policy, you therefore are against mitigating illegal immigration".

It's par for the course for TERB.

That is our difference in opinion.
It would be nice if "Frank thinks the protests had more impact than I do on the election" were the limits of our difference of opinion.

Your memory is shitty or you are telling yourself stories to make yourself feel better.
Projection.
Nice.

In an election between genocide and genocide lite the genocide team will always win.
By definition.
In an election like that, genocide is not on the table as a thing you can affect by voting.

You said do nothing and the dems will win anyways.
You're view of electoral politics appears to be even more deranged than I thought.

We are past day 300 of the genocide and you are still spending your time and anger on me and dem voters who wouldn't vote for genocide.
You have never once said that the genocide is wrong, that Harris and Biden were wrong to support it.
You have never once noted that the genocide has destroyed zionism along with Gaza.
You have never noted that AIPAC is the one that has destroyed democracy and put trump in power.
I find it fascinating how it always comes down to "Why aren't you being my trained monkey?" with you.

You just want to blame me and the dems who honoured 'never again' by refusing to vote for genocide.
You did no such thing.
You don't vote in US elections, my boy.

That is on you and all your zionist friends.
There it is. :)
 

Frankfooter

dangling member
Apr 10, 2015
100,579
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I said your pressure campaign would likely fail and that you had no backup plan since the most likely outcome if you didn't get the Dems to move was to elect Trump.
I was correct. (And no, we haven't forgotten your constant insistence that Trump wouldn't be worse and anyone pointing out the damage he would do was a racist monster.)
The actual pressure campaign to move US policy on Israel has been decades long and will continue for years to come.
No, you were wrong.
You said the genocide wouldn't affect the results and there was no need to worry about it or to try to pressure the dems.
I was right and trump was elected.


Not lying.
If you want to deny your past, go right ahead.
It's the internet. Do what you want.
Prove your claim then.
Its the internet and all there for a good researcher.


Why do you keep lying about what I think?
I have repeatedly pointed out that your "proof" of things doesn't hold up.
You have decided this means I don't believe anything had any effect.
This is a lot like richecag's whole "You criticized Trump's ICE policy, you therefore are against mitigating illegal immigration".

It's par for the course for TERB.
I know, you think that the fact that 29% of dems who voted for Biden but wouldn't vote for Harris and cited the genocide wasn't enough to change a close election.


It would be nice if "Frank thinks the protests had more impact than I do on the election" were the limits of our difference of opinion.
Clearly its not.


Projection.
Nice.
Again, its on the internet, make your case.

By definition.
In an election like that, genocide is not on the table as a thing you can affect by voting.
But in an election like that you would vote and others would stay home.

You're view of electoral politics appears to be even more deranged than I thought.
It was your argument that the dems didn't need to respect the fact that 70% of their voters backed a ceasefire.
You think pushing for them to respect voter's wishes was 'deranged'?

I find it fascinating how it always comes down to "Why aren't you being my trained monkey?" with you.
The same way you think that by refusing to state in exact terms your views they aren't still apparent.

You did no such thing.
You don't vote in US elections, my boy.
Your words:

There it is. :)
Yes, on this board you appear as a zionist.
What you won't say tells as much as what you will say.
 

Valcazar

Just a bundle of fucking sunshine
Mar 27, 2014
37,016
74,448
113
Prove your claim then.
Its the internet and all there for a good researcher.
LOL.
Good lord, why would I waste my time like that?

I know, you think that the fact that 29% of dems who voted for Biden but wouldn't vote for Harris and cited the genocide wasn't enough to change a close election.
One day, you really should read that poll and internalize what it actually says versus what you want it to say.

But in an election like that you would vote and others would stay home.
Absolutely.
Because not voting is a terrible choice, morally and tactically.
That people will make terrible moral choices is a given, of course.
Of course, encouraging people to make the terrible choice is extremely bad.

It was your argument that the dems didn't need to respect the fact that 70% of their voters backed a ceasefire.
You think pushing for them to respect voter's wishes was 'deranged'?
Not at all.
Pushing your representatives is part of democracy.
Doing things stupidly is deranged.

The same way you think that by refusing to state in exact terms your views they aren't still apparent.
There's no point.
Complete agreement of I am a Zionist.


Eerily accurate, wasn't I?
 

Frankfooter

dangling member
Apr 10, 2015
100,579
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LOL.
Good lord, why would I waste my time like that?
Great, we'll just assume you post unfounded slander.


One day, you really should read that poll and internalize what it actually says versus what you want it to say.
One day you will understand what 'never again' means.

Absolutely.
Because not voting is a terrible choice, morally and tactically.
That people will make terrible moral choices is a given, of course.
Of course, encouraging people to make the terrible choice is extremely bad.
Ah yes, we are back to your presumed superiority on all electoral issues and those who choose different from you are making terrible choices.


Not at all.
Pushing your representatives is part of democracy.
Doing things stupidly is deranged.
Pushing back on aiding genocide was 'deranged'?

There's no point.
Complete agreement of I am a Zionist.
Yes, you won't say it out loud, I know.


Eerily accurate, wasn't I?
Now you argue again that I'm responsible, not Harris and the dems.
 
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