Heat Pumps for homes.

[Ponderling]

Did anyone experience issues when using a gas generator to power their furnace.

As there have been some posts online regarding concerns especially with high efficiency ones due to the amputation of sensitive technology inside it or issues whit computers.

Don't think there should be issues as most equipment with sensitive Digital technology has a built-in dc converter inside .

I have a pretty big old UPS that I run the furnace on when power is out. OEM SLA's for it are long gone to the scrap yard.
The thing now lives on two car batteries I found ditched on the side of the road in the days of COVID lock down where there was no hope to recover your core fee. They no longer will crank a car, but happily work with this UPS
6A 120V Ignitor start up phase of the furnace eats battery capacity of UPS fast though .
So I plug the UPS into a circuit the genny powers, UPS charges is battery string ( old school double conversion UPS, heavy but all AC out becomes DC first) and all stays happy.

Another idea would be to, once furnace is out of warrantee, add better DC power regulated supply to the CPU board.
The challenge is a lot of the boards have 24V relays on the same card and the CPU, so most good computer grade supplies are not gonna cut it.

 

[Adamxx]

I have a pretty big old UPS that I run the furnace on when power is out. OEM SLA's for it are long gone to the scrap yard.
The thing now lives on two car batteries I found ditched on the side of the road in the days of COVID lock down where there was no hope to recover your core fee. They no longer will crank a car, but happily work with this UPS
6A 120V Ignitor start up phase of the furnace eats battery capacity of UPS fast though .
So I plug the UPS into a circuit the genny powers, UPS charges is battery string ( old school double conversion UPS, heavy but all AC out becomes DC first) and all stays happy.

Another idea would be to, once furnace is out of warrantee, add better DC power regulated supply to the CPU board.
The challenge is a lot of the boards have 24V relays on the same card and the CPU, so most good computer grade supplies are not gonna cut it.

Thanks, another question, as my goal is to make the backup options simple for even my family to operate when power goes down, virus etc., when I am not around.

My backup generator has electric start, however, since it may be hardly used the battery in it dies. When dead I jumper it from the car to start, no issues.

However, thinking of buying a rechargeable battery booster that they can use to start the generator, as it will be more convenient for them.

Thinking it should work, and it may not need charging to often.

Any comments regarding how long it sustains it’s power when not utilized or issues with starting the generator. Cant always specifications on paper as some say 6 months.

Thought about the UPS solution , as I have “ small” one for my LAN, however, was concerned about the cost and maintenance from their perspective as it needs to be “heavier” and maybe separate from the other.

Thanks again.

 

[Ponderling]

For my electric start genny I just have a wet cell/ deep cycle/gel cell smart battery maintainer that stays plugged in and keeps the battery healthy.

Mine is the one CTC started selling about 10 years ago, then the next year CTC saw how many they sold so they produced a generic clone in their own branding.

I only buy premium gas for the genny, add stabilizer, shake the can, and use it up by feeding it into the cars in the spring time if the genny did not need it over the winter

After I use it I disconnect and drain the tank.
Then mix a strong mix of SeaFoam to about 250ml of gas, and then run the genny dry on that mix, usually riding the choke so the thing does not stall as it chokes on the gunk the SeaFoam moves loose.
Then drain the float bowl.

That I have found is the secret of getting the genny to start the next time you need it.
Add fresh stabilized premium, and a few cranks to get the gas into it and it starts
and runs smooth and does not surge like a partially gunked up carb where old gas has sat and broken down

If it has ran for a while I change the engine oil while it is warm from the clean out run.

 

[Adamxx]

For my electric start genny I just have a wet cell/ deep cycle/gel cell smart battery maintainer that stays plugged in and keeps the battery healthy.

Mine is the one CTC started selling about 10 years ago, then the next year CTC saw how many they sold so they produced a generic clone in their own branding.

I only buy premium gas for the genny, add stabilizer, shake the can, and use it up by feeding it into the cars in the spring time if the genny did not need it over the winter

After I use it I disconnect and drain the tank.
Then mix a strong mix of SeaFoam to about 250ml of gas, and then run the genny dry on that mix, usually riding the choke so the thing does not stall as it chokes on the gunk the SeaFoam moves loose.
Then drain the float bowl.

That I have found is the secret of getting the genny to start the next time you need it.
Add fresh stabilized premium, and a few cranks to get the gas into it and it starts
and runs smooth and does not surge like a partially gunked up carb where old gas has sat and broken down

If it has ran for a while I change the engine oil while it is warm from the clean out run.

Thanks again for some excellent tips need, due to the following.

It has been awhile since I started the power backup plan and purchased the generator and gas cans, with the plan to siphon gas from my vehicles when power was out. Then the bloody introduction of Rollover valve or anti siphon mesh in new vehicles threw a wrench in it, so I really appreciate your the information, as my vehicles have them now.

Now if I can find a easy method to siphon gas from the new vehicles, that the girls can easily use. Not intending to put down the females in any way ladies, as I do love you.

 

[Not getting younger]

Did anyone experience issues when using a gas generator to power their furnace.

As there have been some posts online regarding concerns especially with high efficiency ones due to the amputation of sensitive technology inside it or issues whit computers.

Don't think there should be issues as most equipment with sensitive Digital technology has a built-in dc converter inside .

Living in a rural area, back up power is more a necessity. There’s a few options no matter what. if you want the cats ass, a Generac standby. By the time hook up and install is done likely 10-15k

If you just want something that can power a furnace and a couple other things with extension cords. You can buy 10 such things for the same price. But then you’re also running extensions and have to splice into the furnace power line.

I use a dual fuel and Generlink. It’s connected directly to my hydro meter…. So all I need to do is plug it into to my meter, start it up…And no concerns about back feed etc..It powers the whole house. 6,000 and 8,000 startup and running…

Furnace/freezer/fridge/sump and well pumps, lights, internet, literally everything.

I exclusively use propane which can be stored forever.. I always have 80-100pounds on hand ( two 30 pound tanks dedicated, plus I have three 20 pound tanks which are swapped out for BBQ etc) And if a bad outage occurs, that’s going to last a few days and I can’t get propane to refill. Then I can use gas as emergency redundancy ( have never needed to do that) …Gas gens gum up carbs and more with gas getting old etc……last thing you ever want is a genny that won’t start when you really need it. Also with that configuration, in the event I’m not home. Say down south for a week. All my neighbors need to do is enter my garage, plug into meter and furnace/freezer are good no matter the season.

 

[Adamxx]

Living in a rural area, back up power is more a necessity. There’s a few options no matter what. if you want the cats ass, a Generac standby. By the time hook up and install is done likely 10-15k

If you just want something that can power a furnace and a couple other things with extension cords. You can buy 10 such things for the same price. But then you’re also running extensions and have to splice into the furnace power line.

I use a dual fuel and Generlink. It’s connected directly to my hydro meter…. So all I need to do is plug it into to my meter, start it up…And no concerns about back feed etc..It powers the whole house. 6,000 and 8,000 startup and running…

Furnace/freezer/fridge/sump and well pumps, lights, internet, literally everything.

I exclusively use propane which can be stored forever.. I always have 80-100pounds on hand ( two 30 pound tanks dedicated, plus I have three 20 pound tanks which are swapped out for BBQ etc) And if a bad outage occurs, that’s going to last a few days and I can’t get propane to refill. Then I can use gas as emergency redundancy ( have never needed to do that) …Gas gens gum up carbs and more with gas getting old etc……last thing you ever want is a genny that won’t start when you really need it. Also with that configuration, in the event I’m not home. Say down south for a week. All my neighbors need to do is enter my garage, plug into meter and furnace/freezer are good no matter the season.

Thanks, here is what I currently have as my backup power plan , phase 1.

Installed a DPDT switch during the previous basement upgrade to just before and inline with the furnace's power wiring, and one of the positions wired it to a receptacle outside the house. Hence during a power failure, one only has to switch the DPDT and the furnace power wiring is isolated from the power grid and connected to the receptacle on the outside of house, which can be connected to the dual fuel generator. This configuration also grounds the generator to the existing house ground.

A Reliance Controls WKPBN30 Portable Generator Through-The-Wall Transfer Kit was also installed which easily facilitates connecting the generator to stuff inside of the house, up to 6 power bars ( Hence no need to leave door or windows open for power cords).

The goal is easy and economical application and maintenance, so the girls can use when I am not available.

The next phase is to deploy heat pump and solar/ inverter technology. The details of which are being researched.

 

[Paprika]

I have a rental property and I installed a brand new furnace that's less than 2 years old, the AC is pretty old but working.

I'm trying to think of the cons:

1. I don't really need it, despite the rebate. These cocksuckers make money off the government rebate, so they jacked up the price to $7k when it's only worth $2k. I waste my time and money.

2. It takes up a lot of space.

3. Costly to repair.

Any other cons?

 

[newguy20]

I understand your issues about past all electric, etc.

Most of what I suspect you have is a heat lossy home.

I will outline what I have done on my path of home ownership to cut out heat losses.

Bought the place in Feb 2003. Built in 1967 2 storey, 900 sq ft per floor. Brick veneer clad first floor, aluminum siding clad second storey. Asphalt shed style roof

No snow for 18" around the foundation on the otherwise snow covered ground when I bought
Less snow on the north facing side of the street compared to another house that had the same coloured shingles as me.
So I knew I had a poor insulation issue.

So first few months I built 2x3 stud walls around outside of unfinished dry and parged concrete block basement.
Placed the first insulation in end headers and rim joist slots.
Studs were set a few inches from the concrete so 6" roxul for top of wall, 4" for bottom. Vapour barrier. Roughed in electrical as I went.
Next fall did drywall and some interior walls.

Attic got 6" of batts over the original wimpy paper faced 4" of fibreglass.
Bath ceiling exhaust fans were vented out end walls with terminal ball trap and not just dumped into the attic like I found them.

Windows were two pane but nor sealed between them. I did a lot of removable caulking crack sealing on them to stop the whistling.

Basement windows were crappy single pane and fit really poorly. I made plastic pillows stuffed with fibreglass bats cut to suit and filled the basement windows in over the winter with them.

Dryer exhaust got an insulating sleeve place over it and a foam ball exhaust trap too.

Foam gasket sealed all receptacles and light switches in exterior walls.

Pulled up and reinstalled baseboards and did low expanding latex foam for where drywall did not meet the flooring behind the baseboards.
And where strip wood flooring did not extend to room edge behind bottom of baseboard.
Room by room as I repainted over a few years.

Put new weatherstrip around edges of exterior doors and new transom seals, as the rubber in the old ones was shot.

Lived with that until we paid off the mortgage.

Summer after that I hired in for thermopane window replacement.
I replaced the wood exterior doors with foam core steel clad doors the fit their new frames a lot better.
I replaced the basement windows with thermopane and made sure they fit and were sealed in well.

After 40 years there was almost no paint on the siding.
I had foil faced 2" rigid foam board placed while the siding was off and all joints tuck taped. Then vinyl was placed over that.

I had the fire place fitted with a lock top damper to cut up the flue losses, and have a rigid foam plug the we fit into the fireplace opening when it is idle.

Each step seals up the house a bit more so it uses less energy to heat and cool it.

Have you ever added up the costs of all of these changes and figured out how long it will take to recoup those costs?

 

[Ponderling]

Have you ever added up the costs of all of these changes and figured out how long it will take to recoup those costs?

Most of it has either kept the situation of deteriorating the situation like bad venting.
Or make the basement livable winter and summer.
Also kept exterior brick from spalling from moisture loss freezing on outside of brick.

Plus furnace and a/c uses less energy over time..

The foam under the siding replacement was to deal with paint falling off old siding. The foam was 4K of a 17K job.

We live on a pretty busy street with city bus a school busses so insulation and better windows have a sound reduction peace of mind side to it as well as less heat loss.