Iran has captured 15 british marines
- Thread starter danmand
- Start date
I do have a question about the whole iran sanction thing:
I know it would be like giving a machine gun to a 10 yr old but what right do the Brits and the Yanks have to say to ANYONE you can't build nuclear weapons? I mean, isn't that a little hypocritical? To say: We have em and don't want anyone else to have em so fuck off and stop trying to get em.
I know it would be like giving a machine gun to a 10 yr old but what right do the Brits and the Yanks have to say to ANYONE you can't build nuclear weapons? I mean, isn't that a little hypocritical? To say: We have em and don't want anyone else to have em so fuck off and stop trying to get em.
If you will recall the last time this happened the U.K. did not use nearly such adamant language and indeed that time the boats were in a “grey area.” This time they seem quite certain that the boarding party was on the Iraqi side of the border.assoholic said:.hahaha ya of course they wouldn't lie becase their Brittish, especially being so adamant and all.
We didn't sign a treaty saying we wouldn't build them.....tboy said:I do have a question about the whole iran sanction thing:
I know it would be like giving a machine gun to a 10 yr old but what right do the Brits and the Yanks have to say to ANYONE you can't build nuclear weapons? I mean, isn't that a little hypocritical? To say: We have em and don't want anyone else to have em so fuck off and stop trying to get em.
OTB
I know it's popular to hate the U.S., although how that explains the U.K. and France I don't know. But does anyone on TERB truly believe that Iran having the bomb is in the same catagory as the U.S., U.K. or France having the bomb?tboy said:I do have a question about the whole iran sanction thing:
I know it would be like giving a machine gun to a 10 yr old but what right do the Brits and the Yanks have to say to ANYONE you can't build nuclear weapons? I mean, isn't that a little hypocritical? To say: We have em and don't want anyone else to have em so fuck off and stop trying to get em.
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NO, I don't agree that those maniacs having nuclear weapons is even close to sane people having them but my point still remains: it is still hypocritical for anyone to say to any other country what they can and cannot do.Aardvark154 said:I know it's popular to hate the U.S., although how that explains the U.K. and France I don't know. But does anyone on TERB truly believe that Iran having the bomb is in the same catagory as the U.S., U.K. or France having the bomb?
BTW: I don't hate the US. I am thankful everyday that they are our allies and our neighbours. Without them we'd all be speaking german or russian.
Its also not on your governments public record that a particular state should be irradicated from existence.onthebottom said:We didn't sign a treaty saying we wouldn't build them.....
OTB
I think I missed this one....lookingforitallthetime said:Its also not on your governments public record that a particular state should be irradicated from existence.
At a news conference earlier today, British Prime Minister Blair called the situation with Iran "very serious" and stated that "It is simply not true that they went into Iranian territorial waters. . . I want to get it resolved in as easy and diplomatic a way as possible," but stated that it was important that the Iranian Goverment "understood how fundamental an issue this is for the British government."French
French President Jacques Chirac expressed support for Great Britain's position: "It appears clear that these soldiers [sic] were not in the Iranian zone at the time."
French President Jacques Chirac expressed support for Great Britain's position: "It appears clear that these soldiers [sic] were not in the Iranian zone at the time."
Isn’t a popular belief that US. and Brits. SOP's units have already been operating within the Iranians territories for some times now!
My understanding is that Iran is tidying up on these incursions thus most likely we will see a lot more arrests in the near future.
My understanding is that Iran is tidying up on these incursions thus most likely we will see a lot more arrests in the near future.
You seem to believe it.persis said:Isn’t a popular belief that US. and Brits. SOP's have already been operating within the Iranians territories!
Exclusive: Iranians Had Showdown With U.S. Forces
By Anna Mulrine
As the British government demanded the immediate release of 15 of its sailors whose boats were seized by Iranian naval vessels in the Persian Gulf on Friday, U.S. News has learned that this is not the first showdown that coalition forces have had with the Iranian military.
According to a U.S. Army report out of Iraq obtained by U.S. News, American troops, acting as advisers for Iraqi border guards, were recently surrounded and attacked by a larger unit of Iranian soldiers.
The report highlights the details: A platoon of Iranian soldiers on the Iraqi side of the border fired rocket-propelled grenades and used small arms against a joint patrol of U.S. and Iraqi soldiers east of Balad Ruz. Four Army soldiers, one interpreter, and one Iraqi border policeman remain unaccounted in eastern Diyala, 75 miles east of Baghdad.
During a joint border patrol, both American and Iraqi soldiers saw two Iranian soldiers run from Iraq back across the Iranian border as they approached. The patrol then came upon a single Iranian soldier, on the Iraqi side of the border, who did not flee.
While the joint U.S.-Iraqi patrol was speaking with the soldier, according to the report, the patrol was "approached by a platoon-size element of Iranian soldiers." An Iranian border captain then told the U.S. and Iraqi soldiers that "if they tried to leave their location, they would be fired upon." During this conversation with the Iranian captain, Iranian forces began firing and continued when U.S. troops tried to withdraw.
Iraqi and American forces returned fire "to break contact and left the area to report the incident," the report noted. "The Iranian forces continued to fire indirect fire well into Iraq as Coalition Force soldiers withdrew; for reasons unknown at this time, the Iraqi Army forces remained behind."
It is possible that Iranians thought they were in Iranian territory, according to U.S. military officials. Such border confusions and disputes happen routinely.
In the British naval incident on Friday, Iran claimed it seized the vessels because they were in its territorial waters. U.S. military officials tell U.S. News that the Iranian forces very likely belong to the Iranian Revolutionary Guards, which tend to be far more aggressive than regular Iranian naval forces, which U.S. military officials routinely describe as "extremely professional."
Iranian and Iraqi forces continue to clash in Iraq. U.S. special operations forces have been tasked with nabbing Iranian members of the Revolutionary Guards' al-Quds Brigade, the foreign operations arm of the Iranian military, which also supports Hezbollah in Lebanon and Hamas in the Palestinian territories.
U.S. forces grabbed six Iranians with alleged ties to the Iranian Revolutionary Guards in the northern Iraqi city of Arbil in January, reportedly using stun bombs, seizing computers, and taking down an Iranian flag from the raided building's roof. Iran said the building was a consulate and the men were diplomats–and continues to demand their release. One of Iraq's most powerful Shiite politicians condemned the raid, calling it an attack on Iraq's sovereignty....
By Anna Mulrine
As the British government demanded the immediate release of 15 of its sailors whose boats were seized by Iranian naval vessels in the Persian Gulf on Friday, U.S. News has learned that this is not the first showdown that coalition forces have had with the Iranian military.
According to a U.S. Army report out of Iraq obtained by U.S. News, American troops, acting as advisers for Iraqi border guards, were recently surrounded and attacked by a larger unit of Iranian soldiers.
The report highlights the details: A platoon of Iranian soldiers on the Iraqi side of the border fired rocket-propelled grenades and used small arms against a joint patrol of U.S. and Iraqi soldiers east of Balad Ruz. Four Army soldiers, one interpreter, and one Iraqi border policeman remain unaccounted in eastern Diyala, 75 miles east of Baghdad.
During a joint border patrol, both American and Iraqi soldiers saw two Iranian soldiers run from Iraq back across the Iranian border as they approached. The patrol then came upon a single Iranian soldier, on the Iraqi side of the border, who did not flee.
While the joint U.S.-Iraqi patrol was speaking with the soldier, according to the report, the patrol was "approached by a platoon-size element of Iranian soldiers." An Iranian border captain then told the U.S. and Iraqi soldiers that "if they tried to leave their location, they would be fired upon." During this conversation with the Iranian captain, Iranian forces began firing and continued when U.S. troops tried to withdraw.
Iraqi and American forces returned fire "to break contact and left the area to report the incident," the report noted. "The Iranian forces continued to fire indirect fire well into Iraq as Coalition Force soldiers withdrew; for reasons unknown at this time, the Iraqi Army forces remained behind."
It is possible that Iranians thought they were in Iranian territory, according to U.S. military officials. Such border confusions and disputes happen routinely.
In the British naval incident on Friday, Iran claimed it seized the vessels because they were in its territorial waters. U.S. military officials tell U.S. News that the Iranian forces very likely belong to the Iranian Revolutionary Guards, which tend to be far more aggressive than regular Iranian naval forces, which U.S. military officials routinely describe as "extremely professional."
Iranian and Iraqi forces continue to clash in Iraq. U.S. special operations forces have been tasked with nabbing Iranian members of the Revolutionary Guards' al-Quds Brigade, the foreign operations arm of the Iranian military, which also supports Hezbollah in Lebanon and Hamas in the Palestinian territories.
U.S. forces grabbed six Iranians with alleged ties to the Iranian Revolutionary Guards in the northern Iraqi city of Arbil in January, reportedly using stun bombs, seizing computers, and taking down an Iranian flag from the raided building's roof. Iran said the building was a consulate and the men were diplomats–and continues to demand their release. One of Iraq's most powerful Shiite politicians condemned the raid, calling it an attack on Iraq's sovereignty....
With $100 GPSs (thank you US military) there is no excuse for either side to be someplace they shouldn't be.....
I find it hard to believe it's a coincidence that this has happened just as the UNSC has installed new sanctions against Iran.
They are playing with fire.
OTB
I find it hard to believe it's a coincidence that this has happened just as the UNSC has installed new sanctions against Iran.
They are playing with fire.
OTB
And?DonQuixote said:There have been reports that we're
supporting opposition groups in Iran.
Iran has been stiring up trouble in Iraq as well.
Threats? GWB has been threatening for years. In poker it is called bluffing.bbking said:... it might be time to show Iran's leadership how a nuke really works, at least the threat.
bbk
PS: I predict the crisis about the 15 sailors/marines will be defused nicely by the iranians and the british.
The language so far has not been particularly inflammatory from either side,
and both parties want to end this peacefully.
There appear to be internal struggles going on inside Iran which have impacted this incident.danmand said:Threats? GWB has been threatening for years. In poker it is called bluffing.
PS: I predict the crisis about the 15 sailors/marines will be defused nicely by the iranians and the british.
The language so far has not been particularly inflammatory from either side,
and both parties want to end this peacefully.
Then again the same sort of thing was going on during the U.S. Embassy seizure - hostage taking episode.
If we want to keep the poker analogy going, I would caution to not rely too heavily on a pair of aces.bbking said:I'm not sure you would call it bluffing when you hold a pair of Aces (the U.S.)
If Iran continues with it's threats to put the captured marines on trial - you might see the push become a shove.
Israel paved the way for this kind of action last year and the US is in a delicate position because of British politics.
If Iran is not careful it most likely become costly to them.
bbk
Every poker player has stories of his pair of aces loosing spectacularly to trips or a straight or a flush.
Wasn't that what happened in Iraq?
I know somebody who (foolishly, I agree) fold Aces, because he has lost too much money playing them.bbking said:People who lose with Aces don't bet them hard enough before the flop. While you can lose to any live cards it's not that likely.
So Iran has to ask the question..."Do you feel lucky punk? DO YOU?"
bbk
