Steeles Royal

Palliative Care

Adamxx

Active member
Oct 29, 2018
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Question?

Would appreciate comments on the following :

Your thoughts and or decisions on where you would prefer to receive Palliative care if and when it is necessary.

“Palliative care involves offering physical, emotional and practical support to people with chronic conditions or illnesses due to the aging process.

Would you prefer and or decide to stay at home and receive support from love ones or hired assistance, or stay at hospices, hospitals, long term care facilities etc, where care is provided by non family members.

Realizing that it provides heavy lifting on your love ones, where availability of family, funds, and other items play a part.

Thanks
 

Shaquille Oatmeal

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Jun 2, 2023
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Depends on needs, people etc I guess.
Most would want to spend it at home with loved ones I believe.
But if it can become a burden, or if they are not trained enough to handle you, then its better to receive professional help.
Difficult decisions.
 

RZG

Well-known member
Mar 4, 2007
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Depends on needs, people etc I guess.
Most would want to spend it at home with loved ones I believe.
But if it can become a burden, or if they are not trained enough to handle you, then its better to receive professional help.
Difficult decisions.
I`ve seen a couple cases of family attempting care, it takes them down. One was my ex`s dad, who eventually spent his last 6 weeks in hospital PC. Everyday people can`t accomplish this, it`s a job for a pro.
 

Adamxx

Active member
Oct 29, 2018
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Good comments and yes it can be a very difficult decision.

However, I believe I need to make one and communicate to my love ones , before I become mentally fragile and or to selfish, as I don’t wish to make them feel they need to do the heavy lifting, or feel guilty about placing me in the hands of strangers, as I had to make a decision for one of my parents in the past.
 

avocat

Active member
Apr 7, 2019
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Toronto
Question?

Would appreciate comments on the following :

Your thoughts and or decisions on where you would prefer to receive Palliative care if and when it is necessary.

“Palliative care involves offering physical, emotional and practical support to people with chronic conditions or illnesses due to the aging process.

Would you prefer and or decide to stay at home and receive support from love ones or hired assistance, or stay at hospices, hospitals, long term care facilities etc, where care is provided by non family members.

Realizing that it provides heavy lifting on your love ones, where availability of family, funds, and other items play a part.

Thanks
Always have palliative care at home. Home care benefits the person who needs the care, and the persons that are not ill, but need their loved one nearby. A hospital bed or nursing home is not the place to die, only to be miserable before you die.
 

Ponderling

Lotsa things to think about
Jul 19, 2021
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My mom passed away aged 95 a week ago under pallative care in her LTCH.

Heart attack 3 weeks prior and heart no longer listening to pacemaker signals.
General lungs oxygenation failure as a side effect of damaged heart muscle.
Also developed trouble swallowing.

So not a long glide path for her.
1ml hydromorphone 4 times a day made her more comfy as her blood dissolved oxygen level fell
Even with breathing 2l/min concentrated oxygen from a nasal canual.

She was already in a wheelchair and hospital bed at LTCH, so we just agreed to change dosage plans.
I saw her 12 hours before she passed away.
Sat with her holding her hand for a few hours and wet her mouth with a sponge on a little plastic stick.

She might have recognised me.
She was shifting around a bit, not much else, and 'vocabulary' was down to about 4 mumbled words.

So not a long path in pallative care but I would not want to have taken it on without the LTCH staff help.
 
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RZG

Well-known member
Mar 4, 2007
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Good comments and yes it can be a very difficult decision.

However, I believe I need to make one and communicate to my love ones , before I become mentally fragile and or to selfish, as I don’t wish to make them feel they need to do the heavy lifting, or feel guilty about placing me in the hands of strangers, as I had to make a decision for one of my parents in the past.
I`d like to add that the other case I saw was a friends mom who was in a hospice for her final short while. As with the hospital palliative care, the families said that their loved ones were treated wonderfully with utmost care and compassion, they felt forever grateful. Best of luck to you.
 
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Jake2525

Member
Jan 25, 2011
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Some people don’t realize there is a difference between palliative and end-of-life care.

Having experience with LTCH, I would rather receive homecare and have the conversation with my family so they were aware of my wishes. Also have a power of attorney to follow through on your wishes should you wind up being unable to make your own decisions.
 

oakvilleguy

Well-known member
Nov 30, 2005
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At a SP near me
My dad wanted to go to a hospital. My mom and sister wanted to care for him at home. He ended up staying home and it took such a toll on my mom and sister even with a psw coming each day to help out for an hour. The nurse would come once a week then came every other day as did the doctor. it took him 6 months to die and in those 6 months, my mom looked like she aged 10 years.
 

Adamxx

Active member
Oct 29, 2018
208
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My mom passed away aged 95 a week ago under pallative care in her LTCH.

Heart attack 3 weeks prior and heart no longer listening to pacemaker signals.
General lungs oxygenation failure as a side effect of damaged heart muscle.
Also developed trouble swallowing.

So not a long glide path for her.
1ml hydromorphone 4 times a day made her more comfy as her blood dissolved oxygen level fell
Even with breathing 2l/min concentrated oxygen from a nasal canual.

She was already in a wheelchair and hospital bed at LTCH, so we just agreed to change dosage plans.
I saw her 12 hours before she passed away.
Sat with her holding her hand for a few hours and wet her mouth with a sponge on a little plastic stick.

She might have recognised me.
She was shifting around a bit, not much else, and 'vocabulary' was down to about 4 mumbled words.

So not a long path in pallative care but I would not want to have taken it on without the LTCH staff help.
My condolences and thanks for the comments.

my mom passed away last year (91) at her home. Made the decision 8 years ago to have her receive care at her home, against the wishes of my siblings.

It was tough, however, never regretted the decision and she smiled up until the end.

After trying several care takers, was so very lucky to secure a family that moved within her property and made her last piece of the journey a comfortable one, as she was still in the old country, and I had to manage from here.

Just not sure I want to put my family in a tough situation, as I am not easy now , much less for later.
 

xmontrealer

Well-known member
May 23, 2005
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My mother passed at age 86, after 6 years of progressive Alzheimer's. She had gone way past the point of being able to be cared for properly at home, due to her dementia, even with around-the-clock caregivers.

So we had her placed in a retirement home with a specialized dementia floor.

Anyways, after a few years there, when it was obvious she wasn't eating or drinking fluids sufficiently any more, and under the supervision of a specialized geriatric physician, her morphine dosage was gradually but steadily increased until she passed, as peacefully as we could have hoped for.

It was a 2 week ordeal in the end, and nothing we could have managed in her home that would have compared to the same amount of care and attention she received from the psw's at the retirement home.

As for me, I hope I get hit by a truck, or, if it is inevitable, some form of painless euthanasia before I get even close to the point my mother did...
 

escortsxxx

Well-known member
Jul 15, 2004
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If possible home care. I have done this many times thus far. Not easy but for a healthy person more than possible. However, it should be supplemented with extra resources - a meal service for example, help with the daily chores OR help with the loved one. Its generally easier to out source regular daily chores which if off you plate makes things much more sane.
 
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Gators

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Apr 9, 2023
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I`ve seen a couple cases of family attempting care, it takes them down. One was my ex`s dad, who eventually spent his last 6 weeks in hospital PC. Everyday people can`t accomplish this, it`s a job for a pro.
My father died at age of 102 and we decided to take care of him at home. His mind was sharp like 20 years old . It did took a toll on my sister and myself emotionally the past 3 years of his life buy no regret.
 

xmontrealer

Well-known member
May 23, 2005
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My father died at age of 102 and we decided to take care of him at home. His mind was sharp like 20 years old . It did took a toll on my sister and myself emotionally the past 3 years of his life buy no regret.
A still sharp mind makes a huge difference.

Many people with dementia become very hard to care for. They often resent the lack of mental and physical self-control and self-determination, get very combative when they require personal hygiene care, and often become generally irritable and argumentative. From what the care workers told me at the specialized retirement home my mother was in, the men with dementia are often far more difficult to deal with than the women.
 
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Adamxx

Active member
Oct 29, 2018
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A still sharp mind makes a huge difference.

Many people with dementia become very hard to care for. They often resent the lack of mental and physical self-control and self-determination, get very combative when they require personal hygiene care, and often become generally irritable and argumentative. From what the care workers told me at the specialized retirement home my mother was in, the men with dementia are often far more difficult to deal with than the women.
Right on regarding their combative nature , especially ones with a strong will and pride, due to the lessons learnt in their lives, regarding trusting others and protecting their belongings.

My mom who also had dementia, was quite a challenge, however after visiting and research external care facilities decided on Quality from her perspective , vs quantity of years, knowing her.

Also preferred her to be surrounded by a family ( as all hers were living abroad), with children around her for mental stimulation compared to an environment with only seniors and medication.

We were so lucky to find a “family” to provide the care and “family” atmosphere I wanted for her during her golden years.

One of the most gratifying things I did so far in my life.

Thanks so much to all you guys as your exchanges have made me a bit more at peace with my experiences and past decision and given me more food for my decision.
 

Jenesis

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Jul 14, 2020
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I was my mom’s personal care giver at her end stage. She wanted to pass at home and I made that happen for her. It was HARD. I wouldn’t change it, but it is not an easy thing and I don’’t blame anyone for not being able to do it. It is a long term commitment, it is physically and emotionally draining, it is a lot of on the fly administrative and medical education. It is not for everyone. Again though, I wouldn’t have changed it for the world. It was also an extremely rewarding experience.

Personally, I will not be going palliative. If I know I am going to die soon or I‘m at the start of dementia, I will just throw a party, take a cocktail of pills at the end of the night and simply end it. I am not putting myself or others through it. I have already lived an amazing life. If I went tomorrow, I would have no regrets. So I have would have no problem taking care of it at the end. I am not asking for permission from a bunch of doctors and shit for it. I am not wasting that time and energy. I don’t carry life insurance, I have other investments and assets to pass down, so I don’t need to worry about any clauses that can hold back funds. My family already knows all this, they know everything to do after my death as well. I know it may sound morbid, but this is just the choice I have made.
 

boomboom

Well-known member
Jun 29, 2003
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Central Ont. between here & there
Helping a loved one or close friend during palliative care is a loving gift to give someone. I've helped out with a few close friends. It was tough at times, but very rewarding. Even at home, if you can is better, but not always possible. A rental airbed is a must if they can't move to help reduce or stop bed sores.
Just my $0.02
Boom
 
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opieshuffle

Well-known member
Oct 30, 2004
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There are a billion things that can go wrong with these meat sacks we inhabit. There is no one solution. Example: the minute someone can't move on their own anymore, you now need multiple people to maneuver them around. On toilets. Off. Bathing. Into bed. Out of bed. Regardless of their mental state. You need lifts. You need wheel chairs. Special beds. This person could be 100% with it mentally, but the lack of mobility creates a whole world of challenges. Which wear on their own mental health, let alone, the wear on those family members trying to help and keep them at home and comfortable. Then you add mental decline. Then you add cost of private care on top of the gov't help. PLUS PLUS PLUS. Then the family wrestles with "what's the best solution for ALL?" And that question gets asked several times a week!

Just saying "keep them at home... it's better for them" is very often not a solution. We're living it right now. The anger. The tears. The good days and increasing bad ones. Decisions to stay or put them in LTC. The GUILT of even thinking about LTCH.

But palliative, as I understand it, is REALLY about "end of life". So for me... that's at home, on the best drugs money can buy, to say our good-byes and keep someone as comfortable as possible in the remaining days and hours. BUT, "at home is better" doesn't work when they can't move or function or they're completely "gone" mentally.

All I can say is hug your loved ones. Do the best you can. Decide as a family based on the love you feel for them. And I wish everyone strength. It's the shits man!
 

richaceg

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Feb 11, 2009
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Pallative care is not for every member of the family...my SO volunteered to take good care of her dad. it took a lot from her with the experience...he was staged 4 cancer and from a heavy dude to becoming frail and skin and bones....i wouldn't want to be a burden...i'd want every member of my family to move forward and worry about themselves...if i can afford private care, i'd do it.
 
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Adamxx

Active member
Oct 29, 2018
208
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There are a billion things that can go wrong with these meat sacks we inhabit. There is no one solution. Example: the minute someone can't move on their own anymore, you now need multiple people to maneuver them around. On toilets. Off. Bathing. Into bed. Out of bed. Regardless of their mental state. You need lifts. You need wheel chairs. Special beds. This person could be 100% with it mentally, but the lack of mobility creates a whole world of challenges. Which wear on their own mental health, let alone, the wear on those family members trying to help and keep them at home and comfortable. Then you add mental decline. Then you add cost of private care on top of the gov't help. PLUS PLUS PLUS. Then the family wrestles with "what's the best solution for ALL?" And that question gets asked several times a week!

Just saying "keep them at home... it's better for them" is very often not a solution. We're living it right now. The anger. The tears. The good days and increasing bad ones. Decisions to stay or put them in LTC. The GUILT of even thinking about LTCH.

But palliative, as I understand it, is REALLY about "end of life". So for me... that's at home, on the best drugs money can buy, to say our good-byes and keep someone as comfortable as possible in the remaining days and hours. BUT, "at home is better" doesn't work when they can't move or function or they're completely "gone" mentally.

All I can say is hug your loved ones. Do the best you can. Decide as a family based on the love you feel for them. And I wish everyone strength. It's the shits man!
Thanks. Deciding as a family was a really tough option in our instance.

I being the youngest one when my dad was going through his last years, and I was away studying, felt the elder ones were perhaps more knowledgeable about that stage, and also following traditional guidelines regarding the oldest etc and their presumed powers, left the decisions to them. Maybe it was just that I was not confident enough, as some of their choices, did not align with mines. And my mother just blindly trusted them, as she was not taking it well.

Did I ever learn a lesson, based on some of the outcomes, and promised my mother and myself never to let that happen again.

When it was my mother’s time, we all meet together to discuss and decide. The first time in about 25 years .

Long story short, I had been the only one to keep in frequent touch with her and knew her wishes. A meeting was organized with her children (3), and one of her sisters.

Although my mom was present, her wishes were never asked for, which I brought to their attention.

All, except myself, voted for external residence and care and they decided it was a done deal. Note my mother knew my take before hand and she did not face us or voted during the so called voting.

I had brought it up that no decision is valid without her say prior to the meeting, and tried to agree on guidelines in case a consensus was not possible, allowing my mother two votes in that scenario.

Knowing my mother’s wishes and her two votes and mines, against my siblings’ I had stacked the deck, in her favour .

As a result, my siblings washed their hands more or less.

It was not until five years later they admitted I made the best decision, and one confessed that mom had said to them, she would commit suicide of she was made to leave her home.
 
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