The Shit you find on youtube

[reboot]

You should google "kindred Spirit one more for the gallows" ... its Skinhead music

I didn't but, given the intro, that wouldn't exactly be a big surprise. Even so, the lyrics used for this video are not overtly racist. Someone determined to defend this thing could argue that the music could readily refer to drug dealers even. Likewise, just because the images are of a "black" man and a "white" woman doesn't mean the intent is limited to those identities.

What makes the message blatant and unacceptable is the opening text about the "danger" of interracial dating, and the dubious statistics used at the end to bolster that case.

If I had the time I'd check those stats at the end. If they are accurate then there's not one thing wrong with that video.

Are you sure about that?

The statistics at the end are without any context and they have no meaningful bearing on interracial dating.

"57% of rapes will happen during dates" -- Like when a wasted girl wakes up with a hangover, realizes what she did last night and decides it was forced upon her? What does that have to do with "interracial dating" though?

"80-90% of all rapes are premeditated" -- In the context of the previous statistic, there are a lot of guys going on dates with the intention to rape. Really? (Granted, that's another issue all together.) How is that relevant to "interracial dating"?

"62% of rapes occur between classmates or friends" -- Yeah, sure. Still, it has not bearing on "interracial dating". Does it?

"Of the approximately 1,700,000 interracial crimes of violence involving blacks and whites, 90 percent are committed by blacks against Whites" -- There's no period specified, so I'm guessing this is a multi-year claim. What is the period? And what exactly constitutes "crimes of violence"? Are we talking reported crimes, convicted crimes, or what? Pushing somebody is definitely a "crime of violence". What the heck does that have do with "interracial dating"? (I know what the producers want me to infer, but there is no basis for the inference.)

"In 1994, black men raped 30,000 White women. The black interracial rape rate was 38 times the White rate." -- It isn't clear the "interracial rape rate" gap is based on the the same data as the "1994" claim. Again, you have to wonder whether the "1994" figure refers to convictions, reports, or what. Are the producers telling me that they can't find more current figures in race conscious America? Anyway, what is the basis for the desired inference? Is there even a weak correlation between interracial dating and rape? My guess is no there isn't.

"Of the total of 490,266 acts of multiple-offender interracial violence, no fewer than 93.9 percent were committed by blacks against Whites." -- More of the same. What does that have to do with "interracial dating"? As I've said before, I'm clear what inference I'm supposed to make, but it isn't a valid inference based on the information provided. So no, I'm not going to be a good sheep about it and just ASSume.

"Even though blacks are only 13% of the US population, they account for 49% of the people who get HIV and AIDS." -- Nice. This concerns interracial dating how?

"The gonorrhea rate among blacks is 18 times greater than the rate for whites" -- I guess the "whites" should make sure to use condoms, eh? This has no bearing on interracial dating.

"The rate of P&S syphilis reported among blacks is 5.4 times higher than the rate among non-Hispanic Whites..." -- Hmmm. "non-Hispanic Whites..." Now there's a interesting race distinction. LOL!

All this presented on the the introductory basis: "Have you talked to your kids about the dangers of interracial dating?"

BUT, if it is found that people with Red Hair commit a high rate of, oh, say, car thefts, then wouldn't that indicate some research needs to be done as to WHY? then maybe a solution can be found?

No. Oddly enough for the same reason. There are a lot more correlations out there than there are meaningful relationships. Just because you find a correlation doesn't mean it is causal. Using the hair color example simply highlights that. Most people would think that's a pretty silly relationship to draw (today, things were different in the Middle Ages in Europe), even if it could be done and they would think nothing much of it. The same should be done regarding racial correlations.

What really amazes me though is that this video was supposedly added almost a year ago and it hasn't been taken down.

 

[Berlin]

What really amazes me though is that this video was supposedly added almost a year ago and it hasn't been taken down.

... and over 900,000 view.

 

[Noir]

Horrible. The video poster's username is loveyourrace...hmm.....Racist perhaps? *sigh* While the stats are true, the reason that the video was posted was not to educate about statistics.

 

[reboot]

While the stats are true, the reason that the video was posted was not to educate about statistics.

Go out and by yourself a copy of How to Lie with Statistics by Darrell Huff. It's the other little red book. Read it. Understand it. And then, come back to the presentation of statistics found in that video and ask yourself whether those statistics are true.

 

[tboy]

Again, I will repeat, if I had the time I'd try to verify the stats given, and if they are indeed accurate, the thing about showing this video in schools etc the presenters can then give a lecture or explain what was being represented. That not all of any one race are bad, but that a few represent those statistics given. This could also be a oppurtunity to openly discuss the problems of those stats...and begin a dialogue on what one can do to start a social change....

As for the just desserts example. Sorry, I don't believe that for a second that the police cheif was doing it simply to incite racism. That would be political suicide. I also seem to remember that stat was brought up in amongst a whole load of other stats in regards to the crime rates in Toronto.

With a little editing and verification, I think that it is an awesome video and shouldn't be shunned at all.....and if it enrages some, then great! Why do I say it? Because if "whitey" tries to help "black" people then I have heard "you have no idea what we go through" so if videos like this one incite black leaders to develope programs designed by them for their community, then FANTASTIC.

IMO the video points out a problem, highlights it as a matter of fact, and if it is accurate, then should be a jumping off point for educated discussion (kind of like what it's done here at terb!!!).

I find that the very second ANYONE says ANYTHING about a partifular race, everyone cries RACIST RACIST RACIST instead of examining the root cause. Why can't people discuss the various problems our integrated society faces without anyone playing the racist card?

For the record I have read and watched speeches by some very prominant black leaders (I think Rev Jessie Jackson was one of them) who openly stated that one of the problems african americans face is the dilution of their race by interracial marriage. If I remember correctly (and my memory isn't what it used to be) he referenced something like the loss of their heritage or something or another and was anti-interracial couples.....If I have the time I will see if I can dig it up.

Now I ask you: if a black leader states it, is it a racist remark?

As for the red hair example, I was using that as a very basic statistical fact. Now of course there are other factors that come into play with any scenario but to simply ignore all statistics because they can be manipulated is ludicrous. If they'd done that with sickle cell anemia then who knows how many people would have died unnecessarily. Kind of like smoking: just because someone smokes, and gets cancer, that isn't a 100% guarantee that the smoking caused the cancer but the majority of doctors would immediately jump to that conclusion. The smoker could have been exposed to all kinds of toxins that could have caused it.

Just look at AIDS and HIV. If you're ever seen the movie "and the band played on" at the beginning, they thought it was a problem associated with the lifestyle of those who frequent bathhouses, not an actual disease/virus. They were looking at statistics of how many were getting this "strange" syndrom and they were focusing on bathhouses. Upon further study they found that the bathhouses had nothing to do with it but it got them going in the right direction.........

 

[Noir]

Why can't people discuss the various problems our integrated society faces without anyone playing the racist card?

Because that was the intention of the person posting/making the video. If the races were reversed and it was a black female and the statistics were reversed, I would still say the same thing. A video titled "Have you talked to your kids about the dangers of interracial dating?" is a racist title!

It has been said that the reason that there are higher numbers of HIV/AIDS and STI in the African American population, is because there is a higher incidence of unprotected sex that can be linked to lack of employment opportunities and education. The lack of education limits an opportunity for African Americans to get jobs. Instead of pursuing the more difficult route of education, some turn to the streets, drug use and other high risk activities - where they can be infected. There are a higher number of African American males that are being jailed, and practicing unprotected homosexual sex as well as injection drug use - statistics show that this is the primary way of transmitting the disease.

If the movie were titled "The risks of having unprotected sex" and showed the statistics of each race, sure people would still have something negative to say, because the stats of blacks would still be much higher than that of other races, but it would be showing the entire picture. Heck, American white males make up almost 40 percent of the HIV/AIDS pie chart. That's only a few percent less than the stats of Blacks. I suppose all blacks are to blame? (That's what this video is implying, instead of saying "wrap it up before you present it.")

 

[Mongrel4u]

As for the just desserts example. Sorry, I don't believe that for a second that the police cheif was doing it simply to incite racism. That would be political suicide. I also seem to remember that stat was brought up in amongst a whole load of other stats in regards to the crime rates in Toronto.

Yeah, coincidently when a pretty white girl gets killed by a black person...but when two black people go at it...nobody gives a shit.

Whether he meant to incite racism or not.. the cheif should have known better that releasing something like that at a time like then would definitely incite racism amongst the people...

With a little editing and verification, I think that it is an awesome video and shouldn't be shunned at all.....and if it enrages some, then great! Why do I say it? Because if "whitey" tries to help "black" people then I have heard "you have no idea what we go through" so if videos like this one incite black leaders to develope programs designed by them for their community, then FANTASTIC.

Yeah but it wont...you know it, I know it...everyone knows it

I find that the very second ANYONE says ANYTHING about a partifular race, everyone cries RACIST RACIST RACIST instead of examining the root cause. Why can't people discuss the various problems our integrated society faces without anyone playing the racist card?

Tboy there was clearly racist intent in that video...right in the beginning, the middle and the end. its a video released by some NAZI openly intended to attack black people.

If thats not racist to you then I'd hate to see what is

For the record I have read and watched speeches by some very prominant black leaders (I think Rev Jessie Jackson was one of them) who openly stated that one of the problems african americans face is the dilution of their race by interracial marriage. If I remember correctly (and my memory isn't what it used to be) he referenced something like the loss of their heritage or something or another and was anti-interracial couples.....If I have the time I will see if I can dig it up.

Now I ask you: if a black leader states it, is it a racist remark?[/qoute]

Yes it is a racist remark...what is your point?

 

[mrkman]

Horrible. The video poster's username is loveyourrace...hmm.....Racist perhaps?

YES


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[tboy]

Noir: I totally agree, which is why I said "videos like this bring about intelligent discussion"......

My question was more posed to amazon woman which she repeatedly has not answered.

As I said earlier: the RAINN site openly states that 52% of rapists are white, is THAT a racist comment? Not in my opinion! Just like, other than the opening and closing titles of the video in question, isn't necessarily racist either. I mean, if one wanted to be 100% fair and equal then the video would have to be 12 hrs long to portray all the various options: black guy/white woman, black woman/white guy, korean guy/white woman, white guy/korean woman, Black guy/korean woman, Korean man/black woman, Nigerian Man/EE woman, EE man/nigerian woman, French Polynesian Man/North American Aboriginal Woman etc etc etc etc

 

[tboy]

.....

Yes it is a racist remark...what is your point?

I agree, it iS a racist remark but society wouldn't see it that way......(at least in my opinion).

Yes, that video (now that I actually saw the opening and closing statements lol) is biased. Is it wrong? Not in my opinion (and again, if those stats are accurate).

You see, it is doing what I intend for it to do if shown widespread: create an oppurtunity for intelligent discussion! If anytime we bury something like this for fear of what people might think, nothing ever changes or improves.

 

[Mongrel4u]

You see, it is doing what I intend for it to do if shown widespread: create an oppurtunity for intelligent discussion! If anytime we bury something like this for fear of what people might think, nothing ever changes or improves.

I see what you are saying tboy but we dont need a NAZI video to do this; mainly because we know that it was created out of biases and hate.

 

[tboy]

I see what you are saying tboy but we dont need a NAZI video to do this; mainly because we know that it was created out of biases and hate.

Well, it is things like this that draw society's attention to the problem. If everyone pussyfoots around the issues and everyone is afraid to yell fire while the house burns down, then what good is that?

I find all too often that people don't pick up on subtle hints, suggestions, insinuations and the like. I mean, hell, that's how woman communicate and I never know what the heck they're saying either lol...DOH

 

[Noir]

Well, it is things like this that draw society's attention to the problem. If everyone pussyfoots around the issues and everyone is afraid to yell fire while the house burns down, then what good is that?

I find all too often that people don't pick up on subtle hints, suggestions, insinuations and the like. I mean, hell, that's how woman communicate and I never know what the heck they're saying either lol...DOH

I don't quite agree with that. Once again, if there were a video made that presented the widespread issue of date-rape/AIDS/STD's etc. there is attention drawn to the issue and anyone with half a brain will pay attention. Those who only pay attention to an issue because there is an angry black reverend telling them what to think, or because of a Nazi video that got some black kid to act in it (completely oblivious to the purpose of the video)...will probably do nothing to fix the issues.

People are not that blind to issues that are surrounding them ; they just need to do something to change it THEMSELVES. Get out of the rut that their in, stop making excuses and change things. If they choose not to, that's their problem.

 

[reboot]

In all honesty, I'm the last person to be all that sensitive to the issue of racism. I think a lot of people really need thicker skins.

However, this video is such a blantantly racist POS that I can't understand how anyone could defend it as something to have an "educated" discussion about. Frankly, even without the textual content, this thing still is racist crap. This video is about a BLACK MAN f**king with a white girl while in the background music drones on about hanging the perverts. Sure, separately, the images and music can be considered neutral. Together? NO WAY! The text is there just to make sure all the inbreds that believe this BS get the message because they're probably too retarded from inbreeding to get it with only the moving pictures and sound.

IMO the video points out a problem, highlights it as a matter of fact, and if it is accurate, then should be a jumping off point for educated discussion...

I'm not sure what video you were watching but the one linked to at the start of this thread concerned the dangers of interracial dating. I'm sure (okay, I'm hoping) you do not intend to suggest that interracial dating is a problem. So I'm at a loss as to what "problem" you see this video presenting in a "matter of fact" manner.

I took the time, in case you didn't notice, to list all of the textual claims made in the second half of the video. I think I made the point that they do not really make the case that there is any "danger" to interracial dating. In fact, it is just an arbitrary collection of statistical statements that outside of their intended context have little meaning. But tell me, heck tell everyone, what "problem" are you seeing? I'm sincerely curious what tboy is getting out of this video that is escaping me.

Now I ask you: if a black leader states it, is it a racist remark?

Of course such a presentation would still be racist if it was reversed. Racists come in all colors. But so what?

Now I ask you: Is the video being discussed racist?

As I said earlier: the RAINN site openly states that 52% of rapists are white, is THAT a racist comment?

It's actually a stupid comment. Rapists come in all colors. The issue of rape is hardly about skin color. Focusing on skin color when discussing incidence of rape is kind of like focusing on hair color when discussing incidence of auto theft. Having stated that, I'll grant that some incidences of rape take ethnicity into account. Just have a look at Bosnia.

If anytime we bury something like this for fear of what people might think, nothing ever changes or improves... I find all too often that people don't pick up on subtle hints, suggestions, insinuations and the like.

Okay. I can see a bit of a point here. Alas, I'm not a huge civil liberties fan, and I tend towards believing that free speech is about political speech. This video is not a political statement. It is just a piece of blatantly racist propoganda. Even Americans have some understanding that inciting hatred (which this POS is intended to do) is not acceptable.

 

[Mongrel4u]

Those who only pay attention to an issue because there is an angry black reverend telling them what to think, or because of a Nazi video that got some black kid to act in it (completely oblivious to the purpose of the video)...will probably do nothing to fix the issues.
.

exactly... it will just make it worse

 

[Noir]

Okay. I can see a bit of a point here. Alas, I'm not a huge civil liberties fan, and I tend towards believing that free speech is about political speech. This video is not a political statement. It is just a piece of blatantly racist propoganda. Even Americans have some understanding that inciting hatred (which this POS is intended to do) is not acceptable.

You have quite a way with words. Eloquently said! If only I could put my sentences together like you Reboot! ^_^

 

[tboy]

exactly... it will just make it worse

No, doing nothing will make it worse......

GASP, how can I say that? Because this discussion would never have taken place if that video wasn't produced. If it happens once, it will most likely happen a thousand times.

Since everyone is so dead set that this video will make racism somehow worse, how many in this thread are now against interracial dating? I bet not one person has had their opinion changed by the video. So if it didn't happen here, why should it automatically happen elsewhere?

Again, I fail to see how showing a black man date raping a white girl is racism......what does it matter who is black and who is white? The thing is: IT DOESN'T........So, how can one show the perils of date rape in a non racist fashion? Can you only show white men raping white women?

See the point I'm trying to make here is I DIDN'T SEE THE GUY AS BEING BLACK OR WHITE, I SAW A MAN DATE RAPING A WOMAN......

You see, I didn't pay attention to the opening statement, I saw the title, Rape, and then starting reading the slides prior to the video starting.....

See, maybe it is all of YOU should take a step back and take a deep breath because you obviously saw a BLACK man, raping a WHITE woman!!!!

You see, I don't give a rat's ass about the colour of a rapist's skin: it doesn't even register with me....all I see is a rapist.....in fact, now that I think about it, I don't even think it regestered to me the correlation between the stats at the end to the video. In fact, hindsight being 20/20, in my mind the two are unrelated (for the most part) I think there might have been one tidbit about the percentage of black men who rape white women but the rest was about STDs etc.

Further more, being totally colourblind and not being hypersenstive to race, I can see those of you who are hypersensitive seeing that as racist. Sorry, I don't because once again, I don't care what colour the guy's skin is......

 

[Kyra.Graves]

The video offends me. I had trouble watching it through to the end as I could feel the hatred in it and I found that emotionally disturbing.

Just my opinion here but if one wants to raise consiousness about race relations and promote an intellectual conversation then one can and hopefully will do so in a positive manner. There are plenty of ways that this has and will continue to be done in society but the video was not one of those in my opinion.
I personally don't wish to dwell on the negative here and prefer to focus on the many wonderful and talented people that have worked hard to promote positive change in race relations over the years. Sure there is plenty to still be discussed but when one focuses on the positive expressions one can foster positive beliefs, we can find common ground and work together to make change. When people focus on and promote the negative aspects we often end up feeling further apart and divided in our culture.

Now this is all just my personal beliefs and opinions but I will not forward that link to anyone, I choose not to promote it in anyway. I will leave a few other links here that I think bring race relations (focussing on black/white as that was the topic) to the forefront.
I am glad that the discussion has been civilized and respectful but I'd would rather discussion is borne out of raising awareness and respect than out of the promotion of such hatred.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZFkg0dRo304
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JAwRLwcI4ag
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vnRqYMTpXHc

and for those that prefer mainstream hollywood
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2AEHBwUWCbg

 

[Mongrel4u]

No, doing nothing will make it worse......

Nobody is saying to do nothing... but Nazi propaganda certainly doesn't help

Since everyone is so dead set that this video will make racism somehow worse, how many in this thread are now against interracial dating? I bet not one person has had their opinion changed by the video. So if it didn't happen here, why should it automatically happen elsewhere?

Because the TERB demographic is not a good sample of the North American population. I'm sure you're average Terbie is in a higher income bracket and as a result possesses a higher degree of education and "smarts" to know better (generally speaking here)

many people wont see this...all they will see and get out of it was what was intended

Again, I fail to see how showing a black man date raping a white girl is racism......what does it matter who is black and who is white? The thing is: IT DOESN'T........So, how can one show the perils of date rape in a non racist fashion? Can you only show white men raping white women?

See the point I'm trying to make here is I DIDN'T SEE THE GUY AS BEING BLACK OR WHITE, I SAW A MAN DATE RAPING A WOMAN......

You see, I didn't pay attention to the opening statement, I saw the title, Rape, and then starting reading the slides prior to the video starting.....

See, maybe it is all of YOU should take a step back and take a deep breath because you obviously saw a BLACK man, raping a WHITE woman!!!!

Showing a black man raping a white girl isnt racisim... coupling it with the text and the nazi music is racist because its clear what the point of the video was. ....communication is more than simply what you see; its also what is read and heard in all its entirety.

What I SAW, READ and HEARD was what the video's intentions were.

 

[RTRD]

As I have stated before...

See the point I'm trying to make here is I DIDN'T SEE THE GUY AS BEING BLACK OR WHITE, I SAW A MAN DATE RAPING A WOMAN......

See, maybe it is all of YOU should take a step back and take a deep breath because you obviously saw a BLACK man, raping a WHITE woman!!!!

You see, I don't give a rat's ass about the colour of a rapist's skin: it doesn't even register with me....all I see is a rapist.....

Further more, being totally colourblind and not being hypersenstive to race, I can see those of you who are hypersensitive seeing that as racist. Sorry, I don't because once again, I don't care what colour the guy's skin is......

...is a luxury afforded only to the painfully naive or those in the racial majority (or more accurately the race in power).

Ask South Africans if they have become "aware" of their being white over the course of the last 20 years or so....just as an example. Especially during the period when Black on white crime and violence due to backlash was out of control (I would presume it goes without saying that the majority of white South Africans were very much aware of others being Black during Apartheid...even if they did not believe themselves to be "racist").

All of that said, as everyone keeps pointing out to you (and you keep ignoring), it wasn't a video about date rape...it was an video about interracial dating, and the INFERENCE was that such dating would lead to date rape...with further inference that a Black male would be multiple more times more likely to commit such an act.

As "Reboot" pointed out...none of the stats have ANYTHING to do with interracial dating...indeed, I'd be willing to bet a small but significant sum of money that if someone wear to do a study on date rape and gather statistics based on race, you'd find that white males raping white females was the far and away predominate occurrence because a) there are more white people and hence more white people dating and hence more incidents of date rape, and b) one of the critical elements required for date rape is trust....and, just keeping it real here...I suspect there are different levels of trust for "first dates" amongst interracial couples than amongst same race couples.

Now....if by some chance...the assertion that most interracial date rapes occur between Black men and white women were true (and I don't have a big problem believing it is), then that should not surprise anyone of any reasonable amount of intelligence given that...

a) Most interracial couples are indeed white / Black (both due to the size of representation of both groups statistically in the population, and the significant cultural biases against interracial dating in the Hispanic and Asian communities)

b) Black women just aren't statistically likely to rape white men (though I am sure it happens).

This would be an example of the "Damn Lies" via statistics that someone alluded to.

What you keep TRYING to say is that a video about date rape would be important (it would be) and that the race of the participants should be irrelevant (I am not totally sure about that...it again goes back to that "majority in power" thing...a white guy raping a white girl doesn't pander to or skirt a stereotype, but I see the rational behind your premise).

This wasn't a video about date rape.

Hopefully that is clear now....

BTW...you keep saying that "if the titles and text were deleted"....but they weren't. They COMPLETELY change the inference of the video...