UFC 113: Machida vs. Shogun II

[The Oracle]

I think it is a waste to fire Kimbo. To me, he is in the same category as Chuck Lidell and Tito Ortiz - not / no longer able to compete at the highest level, but too famous to discard. He would make a perfect TUF coach though, he could dispense crazy street wisdom while his assistants did the actual coaching. Kimbo versus Randy Couture as coaches?

GSP versus Koscheck will be boring, Koscheck will be a jerk, GSP will take it seriously and ignore Koscheck and not get into a feud, then GSP will pound him in the ring. Koscheck versus Daly as coaches, winner to fight GSP would had more potential.

Your comparison of Kimbo to Tito and Randy is completely without merit.

Not only is kimbo not able to compete at the highest level. He never did and never could.

Tito and Randy can still give any of the top 205'ers a go. Trust me. They might not win but they can't be taken lightly either.

Unlike you I'm looking forward to the Kos-GSP fight.

Watching Kos get beaten up for 5 rounds greatly appeals to me.

Plus I beleive GSP personifies everything that MMA fighter should be and I enjoy his fight strategies.

 

[Hard Idle]

Nobody should be dumping on Kimbo personally. It's not his fault that he shouldn't have been there in the first place. He had money and opportunity thrown at him and he took it like anybody else would have. What was he supposed to do? Refuse for the good of the sport? Blame Whit for wanting to milk the gimmick and keep the Kimbo fan base in play for as long as possible.

Nobody can say that Kimbo cheated them with lack of effort. He improved somewhat, gave an honest effort in the octagon in all his MMA appearences while being matched mostly over his head, and showed some guts & dignity taking his beatings. Should have been sent home after losing on ultimate fighter, obviously need at least a year and a half of seasoning and conditioning on a smaller circuit before getting yet another chance.

 

[Julian]

Machida I will give it is a good fighter,,but Shogun has nothing to lose,,Machida has everything to lose. I will predict 2nd round TKO for Shogun.

Nice one!

 

[MIRAGE]

The whole card was fairly boring...the Koscheck/daley fight had some moments, but mostly it was Koscheck's faking and daley's cheap shot...
it was pretty boring but the pounding Machida got made up for it...well worth the wait.

He's got a ways to go...

he looked flabby and very winded after the little spurts of fighting...kinda dissapointed in his preparation for this fight...

gonna have to disagree with you on that one. Ive been to a few live, and this card was one of the best. The atmosphere in the bell center was nuts. The last one that i went to in New Jersey was ultra boring, even with GSP on the card.


God Bless..............Andy

 

[Noir@heart]

Needless to say, any moralistic high ground the mouthy UFC president takes rings a bit hollow. If he sticks to his "banned from UFC forever stance," he's a hypocritical clown. We all know that if White thinks he can make money off of Paul Daley, Semtex be back with the "everybody deserves a second chance" rationale...

DW's posturing is so lame.

I agree with many of your points in regards to the fight card.

What you might be missing is Dana White is looking to have the Canadian market embrace what he is marketing, he just goes over the top at times in front of the cameras. Daley and Belcher (in many people's eyes) confirmed exactly why (Canadian) people are worried that someone will leave a cripple and/or the fighters are no better than common criminals and should not be embraced through the public.

Daley is a fool that showed absolutely no respect for his craft but on the same note I find White should have fired Forest Griffin for his running out of the ring whenever he loses after running his mouth.

 

[Manji]

Some points about UFC 113...
Got to do this fast as I'm in a rush (sorry about any grammatical or spelling mistakes):

Kimbo vs Mitrione
Kimbo looked better last night but he's not cut out for the UFC - his heart may be in the right place but he's started too late in his life to become a UFC fighter....
Kimbo should have done what he's always done and that is to brawl and throw some big shots...Instead he tried to wrestle and all he did was put himself in danger of submissions and he also ending up gassing quicker....
Mitrione seems to improve everytime he fights....Too bad he's in his thirties because he looks like he could have been a contender....

Belcher vs Cote
Belcher is delusional if he truly thinks he can hang with Silva...He could barely hang with Cote...His striking is sloppy and if Silva would KO him in the first round (providing he didn't fuck around)...
I didn't think the Face Spike was so bad...Spiking someone on his head is extremely dangerous but the Face Spike just doesn't strike me as that dangerous especially if you can protect your face with your hands and arms...

A year or so ago I said that Shogun would be the most dangerous threat to Machida (and some guys scoffed at the idea).....I just wanted to say "I told you So!"
I'm glad to see Shogun is at top of his game and is now Light Heavyweight Champion of the UFC....

 

[dj1470]

Why would Machida go to Japan?

DREAM and big $$$

No evidence - just something I heard through the grapevine

 

[C Dick]

Your comparison of Kimbo to Tito and Randy is completely without merit.

Not only is kimbo not able to compete at the highest level. He never did and never could.

Tito and Randy can still give any of the top 205'ers a go. Trust me. They might not win but they can't be taken lightly either.

Unlike you I'm looking forward to the Kos-GSP fight.

Watching Kos get beaten up for 5 rounds greatly appeals to me.

Plus I beleive GSP personifies everything that MMA fighter should be and I enjoy his fight strategies.

I did not mean to suggest that Kimbo's career was like Tito and Lidell, Tito and Chuck were worthy champions, Kimbo was nothing close. But I think that all three of them are now at a point where their fame greatly exceeds their current ability. You do not really want to give Tito or Chuck a title shot, because they would not be competitive, I don't think. Chuck certainly used up all his second chances. But they are well known and people want to see them perform, so you want to find something like TUF where they can draw viewers but not get hurt.

I totally agree that GSP personifies what an MMA fighter should be, and I am really looking forward to him pummeling Koschek. I saw their earlier fight in person in Los Vegas. There was only one guy in the whole crowd cheering for Koschek, he was standing right behind me. I was just saying that there might be less tension between the coaches on TUF, because GSP is classy and less likely to get into trash-talk and shoving, which seems to be what they like on TUF.

 

[Manji]

I totally agree that GSP personifies what an MMA fighter should be, and I am really looking forward to him pummeling Koschek. I saw their earlier fight in person in Los Vegas. There was only one guy in the whole crowd cheering for Koschek, he was standing right behind me. I was just saying that there might be less tension between the coaches on TUF, because GSP is classy and less likely to get into trash-talk and shoving, which seems to be what they like on TUF.

Too bad Sakuraba is past his prime (way past his prime) because he personifies what a MMA fighter should be....
A friendly jokester outside the ring and a true entertainer inside the ring....
Sakuraba fought the toughest guys in Pride....And he put himself at risk just to entertain the crowd (and he lost some fights because of it)....
GSP should take some notes from Sakuraba in that a fighter should not forget he's there to entertain the crowd as well as fight....And you should not enter a fight thinking not to lose and but enter a fight to win and finish.....

Right now....I think Shogun truly personifies what an MMA fighter should be both inside and outside the cage...
Right now Shogun has one of the best Biographies in MMA:
A young fighter who quickly became one of Pride's elite.... then he came to the UFC and lost to Griffin (a huge upset) and had to have surgery on both knees (many thought his career was over)....Came back and beat Coleman and Lidell looking stronger with each fight....Lost to Machida which many felt he was robbed...And then KOed Machida in their second fight to be UFC LightHeavyweight Champion..
Feel good story of the Decade (for MMA)....

 

[GotGusto]

Kimbo was never a good fighter. He's just a street brawler.

Tito was never a real champion. He always got beat by his betters. He has a big mouth that exceeds his abilities in the cage.

Chuck Lidell was a decent fighter.

 

[The Oracle]

Too bad Sakuraba is past his prime (way past his prime) because he personifies what a MMA fighter should be....
A friendly jokester outside the ring and a true entertainer inside the ring....
Sakuraba fought the toughest guys in Pride....And he put himself at risk just to entertain the crowd (and he lost some fights because of it)....
GSP should take some notes from Sakuraba in that a fighter should not forget he's there to entertain the crowd as well as fight....And you should not enter a fight thinking not to lose and but enter a fight to win and finish.....

Right now....I think Shogun truly personifies what an MMA fighter should be both inside and outside the cage...
Right now Shogun has one of the best Biographies in MMA:
A young fighter who quickly became one of Pride's elite.... then he came to the UFC and lost to Griffin (a huge upset) and had to have surgery on both knees (many thought his career was over)....Came back and beat Coleman and Lidell looking stronger with each fight....Lost to Machida which many felt he was robbed...And then KOed Machida in their second fight to be UFC LightHeavyweight Champion..
Feel good story of the Decade (for MMA)....

Entertaining is one thing, taking a beating to give one is another. Brain damage isn't pretty case in point the former Cassius Clay.

Until somebody comes along that can stuff GSP's taledowns then I expect more of the same and I'm okay with that.

Although I expect he will stand with KOS more than he did with Hardy. Like he did with hughes most likely.

shogun has the potential to be the most entertaining fighter in the UFC, he's that good.

 

[Manji]

Entertaining is one thing, taking a beating to give one is another. Brain damage isn't pretty case in point the former Cassius Clay.

Until somebody comes along that can stuff GSP's taledowns then I expect more of the same and I'm okay with that.

Although I expect he will stand with KOS more than he did with Hardy. Like he did with hughes most likely.

shogun has the potential to be the most entertaining fighter in the UFC, he's that good.

Taking a beating to beat your opponent sounds more like Big Nog (his fights against Bob Sapp, Crocop and Tim Sylvia come to mind).....

The top Pride Fighters took some heavy damage but that's because the fights were real wars and most fighters stepped up to fight and hardly played it safe (except Arona)....

To me more of the same with GSP means more boring fights....
Really the only champion I do not look forward to when he fights because of his play it safe style.....

I'm so Happy Shogun's back....
He's a UFC champion that I look forward to seeing fight again (used to be like that with Anderson but now its 50-50 depending which Anderson shows up)....

 

[The Oracle]

Taking a beating to beat your opponent sounds more like Big Nog (his fights against Bob Sapp, Crocop and Tim Sylvia come to mind).....

The top Pride Fighters took some heavy damage but that's because the fights were real wars and most fighters stepped up to fight and hardly played it safe (except Arona)....

..

Sorry I didn't quite word that right.

Sak took a lot of punishment in the W.Silva loses. Trying his best to entertain the crowd.

It took it's toll on his health in the end

 

[Captain Fantastic]

Sakuraba took excessive punishment because he was fighting guys so far out of his weight class. He was a 170lber if he fought at the natural weight for his body frame, perhaps a small MW, who fought at HW and LHW.

In my admittedly biased and not-so humble opinion, he should be on any serious MMA fan's all-time top-10 P4P list. Look at his fight record, quality of opposition, etc.

It was a travesty, almost criminal, the way Pride matched him against all of the top fighters, regardless of size disparity... I shuddered at a few of the beatings he took - Wand, CroCop and Arona come to mind.

My only hope is that he did not suffer a great deal of permanent, debilitating or life-shortening injuries. My (our) entertainment is not worth it.

 

[Captain Fantastic]

gonna have to disagree with you on that one. Ive been to a few live, and this card was one of the best. The atmosphere in the bell center was nuts. The last one that i went to in New Jersey was ultra boring, even with GSP on the card.

God Bless..............Andy

The atmosphere was off the hizzy. The fights? Meh.

 

[dj1470]

Within the next few weeks Tito Ortiz will leave this season of TUF to be replaced by Rich Franklin.

Anybody know why?

 

[The Oracle]

Within the next few weeks Tito Ortiz will leave this season of TUF to be replaced by Rich Franklin.

Anybody know why?

There were a bunch of rumours floating around.

One was that he reinjured himself.

Another was that there was problems with Jena ( this was before the assault incidence).

He had to be hospitalized and put on IV due to infection ( possible staph)

whatever it is Dana said that everything is okay between them so that tells me it has nothing to do with his attitude.

watching the last episode of TUF Tito did look really slow in the dodgeball game and I was wondering if there was something wrong with him.

In the end Franklin-chuck will be a very entertaing bout so all is good in UFC land.

 

[dj1470]

If Rampage could beat Rashad in a few weeks.............

Rampage vs Shogun would be fight of the decade!

 

[The Oracle]

If Rampage could beat Rashad in a few weeks.............

Rampage vs Shogun would be fight of the decade!

Remember though Rampage was destroyed by shogun in Pride and this isn't the worn out version of shogun like it was with W.Silva on their rematch.

The super fight in my estimation is Shogun/A.Silva. because Shogun will trade with Anderson.

don't get me wrong I love Page but I'm not sure he's with the right camp or his head is on right anymore.

 

[GotGusto]

If Rampage could beat Rashad in a few weeks.............

Rampage vs Shogun would be fight of the decade!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kJppfgTIKrM

Yeah, it was a long time ago and Rampage has stepped up his game since. It'd be interesting, but not sure about fight of the decade.

Rampage is almost superhuman in the beating he's willing to take. Repeated knees to the torso and face, goddamn.