Universal Basic Income

[JohnLarue]

I'm fine with tariffs, even if they result in counter tariffs. How much stuff do we export to China and India relative to how much we import from them? A third? A quarter? We only really lose on stuff we cannot produce domestically, which is NOT the majority of those goods.

that would be inflationary
govt policy has already made the Bank of Canadas job of maintaining price stability more difficult than it should be

again tariffs will require govt to pick and choose winners.
they are terrible at doing this and everything Justin Trudeau touches turns to shit

he would wrap tariffs around anything labelled green or connected to liberal insiders and let counter tariffs decimate our resource sector

much of the manufactured goods from China is imported into Canada by large multinational companies, particularly US based large multinational companies
they will view Canadian tariffs as anti-competitive and demand Washington take actions (counter tariffs)
We do not want to start a trade war with the US . Canada will lose that battle and badly (softwood lumber)

The idea isn't to enact blanket tariffs, but to apply tariffs in a way that is in keeping with export country's standard of living, in order to make manufacturing a level playing field. The metric used could be GDP-per-capita, or median salary, or something else along those lines. Start the tariffs low, then ramp them up until equilibrium is achieved.

sneak up on your trading partners with ever escalating tariffs?
yeah Ok , they wont recognize that ... not
hows the gradual implementing of carbon taxes working out for the corrupt moron?

The metric used could be GDP-per-capita

we already have a declining GDP-per-capita, trade wars will only accelerate the decline

or median salary, or something else along those lines

median salary, is not directly relate to the cost of imported goods

think about the number of sales, transportation and distribution jobs lost by artificially increasing the cost/ price of imported goods

We need to undo decades worth of wealth disparity caused by cheap global trade, so it'll take decades to correct.

wealth disparity caused by cheap global trade ??

a flat screen Tv that use to sell for $800 now cost $200
a computer , monitor and printer combo cost $5000 in 1985 has been replace by $500 laptops with 100 X the capabilities

How much are you willing to pay for a Canadian made cell phone , complete with a birch bark case ?
want to buy your kid a new Canadian made bicycle? $500 to $1,000

The pandemic supply disruption did not convince Canadian and American companies to reshore production in any meaningful way, so I doubt that's going to happen without legislative action. And what kind of legislative action would that be?

an economically damaging legislative action

nobody will invest the next dollar one in Canada if govt starts dictating how supply chains are managed

less govt is required, not more govt

 

[Frankfooter]

that would be inflationary
govt policy has already made the Bank of Canadas job of maintaining price stability more difficult than it should be
again tariffs will require govt to pick and choose winners.
they are terrible at doing this and everything Justin Trudeau touches turns to shit
he would wrap tariffs around anything labelled green or connected to liberal insiders and let counter tariffs decimate our resource sector
much of the manufactured goods from China is imported into Canada by large multinational companies, particularly US based large multinational companies
they will view Canadian tariffs as anti-competitive and demand Washington take actions (counter tariffs)
We do not want to start a trade war with the US . Canada will lose that battle and badly (softwood lumber)
sneak up on your trading partners with ever escalating tariffs?
yeah Ok , they wont recognize that ... not
hows the gradual implementing of carbon taxes working out for the corrupt moron?
we already have a declining GDP-per-capita, trade wars will only accelerate the decline
median salary, is not directly relate to the cost of imported goods
think about the number of sales, transportation and distribution jobs lost by artificially increasing the cost/ price of imported goods
wealth disparity caused by cheap global trade ??
a flat screen Tv that use to sell for $800 now cost $200
a computer , monitor and printer combo cost $5000 in 1985 has been replace by $500 laptops with 100 X the capabilities
How much are you willing to pay for a Canadian made cell phone , complete with a birch bark case ?
want to buy your kid a new Canadian made bicycle? $500 to $1,000
an economically damaging legislative action
nobody will invest the next dollar one in Canada if govt starts dictating how supply chains are managed
less govt is required, not more govt

So less government, less social services and less CPP is what you want?

 

[bazokajoe]

There are very few people who deserve UBI. Probably 1% or less of the population.

 

[Frankfooter]

There are very few people who deserve UBI. Probably 1% or less of the population.

That wouldn't be very universal.

 

[JohnLarue]

There are very few people who deserve UBI. Probably 1% or less of the population.

start handing out fee money and the number who feel they deserve free money will start to grow and quickly

 

[jeff2]

actually the invention of the steam engine, the invention of the machine lathe and Henry Fords assembly line all were quantum leaps in terms of manufacturing employment relative to any changes that may have occurred in the eighties
and all 3 of those led to massive increases in manufacturing employment

the 1980s manufacturing employment likely increased world wide as millions in Asia started making 'things'

where things are made is quite different from how the are made
robotics ideally removes minimum wage costs for repetitive tasks from the equation, which was Asia's competitive advantage
conclusion: obtain in demand skills that apply decision making


does tech feed your family ?
does tech cloth your kids ?
does tech provide you shelter ?
no

trade does




you can not stop it
innovation and advancements is embedded in human nature
i find it odd how so many on the left lament and despise human progress

without such progress you would spend half your day hunting your next meal with a stick and a rock

Turning a factory guy into a software engineer is only limited by the the factory guys desire and attitude
if successful he is better off and more productive, a plus for society
a added bonus is software engineers tend not to strike

Well, I am talking about North America.

Forty years of falling manufacturing employment : Beyond the Numbers: U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics

Despite being a leading driver of employment growth for decades, manufacturing has shed employment over the past 40 years as the U.S. economy has shifted to service-providing industries. This article looks at the broad employment trends in manufacturing over the past 40 years, as well as the...

www.bls.gov

 

[Frankfooter]

start handing out fee money and the number who feel they deserve free money will start to grow and quickly

Like old people?

 

[bazokajoe]

start handing out fee money and the number who feel they deserve free money will start to grow and quickly

Agree but I feel people who are autistic, down syndrome, bound to a wheelchair(not fat lazy people). Deserve to have a decent standard of living. People who choose not to work...fuck'em.

 

[csmitting]

Sounds good doesn’t work

 

[JohnLarue]

Agree but I feel people who are autistic, down syndrome, bound to a wheelchair(not fat lazy people). Deserve to have a decent standard of living. People who choose not to work...fuck'em.

some people are born with disabilities or get severely injured at some point which prevents or severely limits their ability to work. life can be cruel
a decent society will support these people

that is quite different from UBI

pay people not to work and far too many wont work
Canada's GDP per capita is already stagnating and falling behind our trade partners
standards of living are determined by a nations productivity >>>> GDP per capita

very few people jump out of bed in the morning, rip roaring to go to work , hence the invention of the snooze button
but eventually they arise to be productive because there is incentive to work . need to pay the bills.

 

[JohnLarue]

Well, I am talking about North America.

A discussion of North American manufacturing , while ignoring the rest of the world ?
what is the name of the economics course that taught you to pretend competition does not exist ?

 

[southpaw]

what is the name of the economics course that taught you to pretend competition does not exist ?

Socialism 101

 

[JohnLarue]

Socialism 101

good point

 

[jeff2]

A discussion of North American manufacturing , while ignoring the rest of the world ?
what is the name of the economics course that taught you to pretend competition does not exist ?

[/QUOTE]
We can all celebrate that the guy in Asia has a few bucks more but that does help the guy here.
And even in Asia, automation of those jobs is a concern.

 

[JohnLarue]

We can all celebrate that the guy in Asia has a few bucks more but that does help the guy here.

stating the obvious that competition is fact of life is not celebrating the guy in Asia
stating the obvious that competition is fact of life should " help the guy here" recognize the fact he needs to compete
(apparently some do not recognize facts of life right away)

And even in Asia, automation of those jobs is a concern.

gee our competition has challenges and concerns too ?
i wonder who will address the challenges and concerns better ?
i wonder who will address the challenges and concerns better and improve the standard of living of its citizens ?

 

[jeff2]

Oh

stating the obvious that competition is fact of life is not celebrating the guy in Asia
stating the obvious that competition is fact of life should " help the guy here" recognize the fact he needs to compete
(apparently some do not recognize facts of life right away)


gee our competition has challenges and concerns too ?
i wonder who will address the challenges and concerns better ?
i wonder who will address the challenges and concerns better and improve the standard of living of its citizens ?

Oh. I forgot. Everything is fine. Back to competition. Nothing to discuss here folks.

 

[JohnLarue]

Oh

Oh. I forgot. Everything is fine. Back to competition. Nothing to discuss here folks.

I did not say that

what part of the following made you think we do not have challenges and concerns ??

" gee our competition has challenges and concerns too ?"

you might want to consider upgrading the comprehension skills, after all its a competitive world out there

 

[jeff2]

nobody said that either

what part of
" gee our competition has challenges and concerns too ?"
made you think we do not have challenges and concerns ??

you might want to consider upgrading the comprehension skills, after all its a competitive world out there

The bottom line is I can see that you have no knowledge of manufacturing employment levels in north america in recent history.

 

[JohnLarue]

The bottom line is I can see that you have no knowledge of manufacturing employment levels in north america in recent history.

wrong , i an well aware of manufacturing employment
The bottom line is I can see that you have no knowledge of manufacturing. economics , trade or even human nature

its not as if nobody ever predicted job losses to robotics for the last 50 to 70 years
its prediction that has become .........a fact of life

this is getting almost to the point of being cruel.
you should move on

 

[jeff2]

wrong , i an well aware of manufacturing employment
The bottom line is I can see that you have no knowledge of manufacturing. economics , trade or even human nature

this is getting almost to the point of cruel,.
you should move on

I think you should move on. Good bye.