wind verus nuclear power

WhaWhaWha

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Aug 17, 2001
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Between a rock and a hard place
Nuclear energy is clean, safe, cheap, and the most viable solution to this planets energy needs. I think Dan Akroyd summed it all up in his counter point to Jane Curtin on SNL news. They were arguing the merits versus the risks of Nuclear and alternative energy. Dan was pro Nuclear. Jane was anti.

Jane, you ignorant slut. If your views would become policy then you would be left alone in your now darkened bedroom, staring at your now useless vibrator.
 

Meister

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Apr 17, 2003
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WhaWhaWha said:
Jane, you ignorant slut. If your views would become policy then you would be left alone in your now darkened bedroom, staring at your now useless vibrator.
That would be a good thing for us under-utilized men.
 

Goober Mcfly

Retired. -ish
Oct 26, 2001
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WhaWhaWha said:
Nuclear energy is clean, safe, cheap, and the most viable solution to this planets energy needs. I think Dan Akroyd summed it all up in his counter point to Jane Curtin on SNL news. They were arguing the merits versus the risks of Nuclear and alternative energy. Dan was pro Nuclear. Jane was anti.

Jane, you ignorant slut. If your views would become policy then you would be left alone in your now darkened bedroom, staring at your now useless vibrator.
That wasn't about nuclear energy, that was about China and Taiwan relations. You ignorant slut.
 

papasmerf

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Goober Mcfly said:
That wasn't about nuclear energy, that was about China and Taiwan relations. You ignorant slut.
But what about the fear of the Pepsi syndrome?
 

lonely guy

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How much advancement has their been to nuclear power plant technology over the past 10, 20, 30 years???
 

bishop

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I recall this issue popping up several times already on TERB. People will believe whatever they want because no one really knows the economics of either wind or nuclear.

Wind is nice, but when it is hot and not windy where will everyone get the juice to run thier AC? But when it is windy enough to generate power then it is cool enough not to run AC. Wind power is a natural hedge against itself that ensures that it can not serve Ontario well during hot summer days.
I would be more pro for solar panels than wind since the brighter the day the hotter it gets and the more electricity you would use, but the current economics of solar is even less than that of wind.

Nuclear on the other hand is tried, true and cheap.

It would be nice to have a good portfolio of alternative energy sources, but when you are desperate for power you have to build what makes economic sense first. Maybe in 5 years when we have enough power to serve our needs, that this province will have the breathing room to develop significant amounts of alternative sources of power. But for now nuclear all the way.
 

MarkII

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I don't know the answer to this question, but how many wind gernerators would it take to replace a coal or nuclear station?

Obviously the output of the existing station would affect the number of wind generators needed.

Is there a base line number?

(Meaning this amount of wind generators replaces X amount of compatible current generation.)

Is it possible to create enough wind generators to replace what we have now? Or would they have to be on every street corner to replace what we have now? This is a honest question..no I am not trying toi make a statement...I do not really know.

I have also wondered why new buildings have not been required to put wind generation units on their roofs? It can't hurt! If it takes 20% off the power needed away during windy conditions..it would more than pay for the added cost very quickly.

Or is that even feasible?

M2
 

Meister

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Apr 17, 2003
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enduser1 said:
Before that the the age of revolution and Napoleonic Wars. IMHO we are replaying the Napoleonic Wars age of Revolution scenario. Right now we are in the age of revolution transitioning to the Napoleonic Wars.
In that case we should keep Bush around a little longer. :eek:
 

shakenbake

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Nov 13, 2003
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The Lurker said:
Don't forgete that coal bunning releases more radiation than a nu-cl-ear plant too!

Of course I'd rather get a hummer, than drive one... :cool:
You got that one right. The most radioactive site on the Uranium processing plant i worked at was where the ash from a coal burner was dumped.

shakenbake
 

shakenbake

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rubmeister100 said:
The Pickering Wind Turbine produces 1 megawatt when running in a 10 mph wind.

The nuclear plant produces 5000 megawatts (enough for a city of 2 million people)

So, it would take approximately 5,000 wind turbines to replace the Pickering nuclear plant. And it was built in 1972, newer units are more efficient.

Here is an interesting quote:


"Regarding wind power, Dr. H.I.H. Saravanamuttoo, Carleton University (Ottawa, Canada) Professor Emeritus of mechanical engineering, shows that to provide the electrical power needs of even a small city such as Ottawa, would require hundreds of windmills, each as high as the Peace Tower, located in a windy area. The environmental cost of building these monstrosities would be enormous and they would cause significant visual and noise pollution, not to mention the death of thousands of birds that would collide with the moving blades.

Dr. Howard C. Hayden, Emeritus Professor of Physics, University of Connecticut laughs at the notion that wind power can ever make a significant contribution to our energy needs, "After all, since wind energy schemes have a thousand-year head start on fossil fuels, there must be some reason why wind makes so little contribution to our energy picture!" Indeed there is - Dr. Hayden explains, "To produce an average of 1000 MW, the power produced by any large conventional (coal, oil, nuclear, gas) power plant, would require about 833 square kilometers of wind turbines. That's the area of a mile-wide swath of land extending from San Francisco to Los Angeles. Multiply that by about 30 and you have California's electricity."

After decades of embracing, supporting and subsidizing windmills, California now has 3,200 wind turbines. However, this made no difference at all to the state's recent energy crisis, as the net contribution of all of these wind turbines was still only about 1.1% of California's electricity. But what about if California had 100 times as many windmills? Could they get 100% of their power from windmills?

"Not a chance," says Dr. Hayden. "Most of the time, the windmills would produce very little power, and, of course, when there's no wind, there's no power at all. At those times, other power sources have to be ready to produce 100% of the power requirements so windmills do not allow any other power plants to be taken out of service. In the several times per year that the winds were strong enough that the windmills could produce their full capacity, the 320,000 hypothetical windmills would produce about five times as much power as California needed at the moment. Under those circumstances, about 80% of them would simply have to be turned off, because at all times the power put into the grid must equal the power consumed."

Dr. Hayden concludes, "In recent years, Denmark has gained a certain amount of fame with its wind turbines. No, they don't get much electricity from them. They sell them to suckers."
hey rubmeister, please check your decimal point. I think it's 500 and not 5000 megawatta. I could check with a friend at OPG who's been there fro a number of years....
 

The Lurker

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Sep 7, 2005
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rubmeister100 said:
The figure I got from one site was rounded. Pickering has eight reactors which each produces 515 megawatts.

Two are not operational (IIRC) so the plant can produce up to 3000 megawatts presently. Or about 2500 to 3000 windmills.
And how many dirty, old style coal plants? Not taking the piss, I don't know. How many MW they shove out. To bad the new hybrid plants are soooo expensive.

That and watch Discovery channel to see how Hydro is faring. Won't catch me living down range from those dinos. Just how long do people think high stress concrete lasts?
 

Keebler Elf

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enduser1 said:
Hi,
While on the subject of politicians: Do you see the current premier of Ontario as a man able to start James Bay two moving? Re-tool Bruce nuclear. Build new northern Ontario Hydro dams? What about any politician in Ottawa? And I mean any of them?
The trial balloons on new investments in nuclear power are already out there...
 

ceo8888ca

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Mar 11, 2003
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You are finally onto their trail...

Keebler Elf said:
The trial balloons on new investments in nuclear power are already out there...
The whole thing is with the Federal Government and AECL ! AECL and its high-priced staff has no justification for existence since they have not made a "single" sale for the last dozen years. Like CBC, the AECL with its CANDU (uniquely Canadian) technology, will not be allowed to be disbanded.

There are forces within the Federal Government to pressure Ontario to continue down the Nuclear path (not that it's unsafe or anything).

The scheme here is to use some foreign investors as a "front", provide them with a "low interest" loan to run some more new stations and the government will look after the stations' liabilities as before.

That way, it's a win-win-win situation. Feds can keep AECL, Ont can can have her power generation (it will take 6-8 years though), and some UK (I think) investors will make some money with very little investments of their own.

The Losers - you and me! Paying the governments so we can listen to their "spin".

Mark my words, I know these things .... :rolleyes:
 

contractor

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Have not been online for a while , thought I would reply to this thread .

wind power has a 30% usability rate due to well .. the wind. To get enough power to be usable you would have to buid enough turbines in enough different areas to ensure you recieved the required amount of power. Ie., if you needed 100 megawatts of generating capacity you have to build 300 megawatts of capacity. This does not include the required transmition capability.( our current capability is at max it would require more.)

Nuclear power is the cheapest to operate. But is by far the most expensive to build. The by products are also a problem. With the need right now for power it does not make a lot od sence to go with a system that may not at present meet our needs.
 

Keebler Elf

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ceo8888ca said:
The whole thing is with the Federal Government and AECL ! AECL and its high-priced staff has no justification for existence since they have not made a "single" sale for the last dozen years.
Well, part of that's b/c Canadians have been so fear-mongered to believe that every nuclear reactor is a Chernobyl just waiting to happen. If and when we start building more nuke plants, the AECL will be involved.
 
Ashley Madison
Toronto Escorts