Windows killing the Netbook

Berlin

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Is Windows killing the Netbook?

http://www.tech-no-media.com/2009/06/is-windows-killing-netbook.html

- Posted on Monday, June 1, 2009 by Erlik -

I suspect that Windows is slowly killing the netbook concept. I realized this when I walked into a big computer shop and saw the following sign beside the Netbooksaisle: please note that these computer have reduced functionality and will not run games.

After investigation it seems that the sign was put there by the salesmen because a lot of consumer that had purchased netbooks were returning them when they realized that these small machines were not able to perform all the tasks of a full size computer, like playing games or editing video. Most of us would say: duh, of course such heavy applications would be killing a netbook processor, that is not what a netbook is for. The question is: what made these consumer believe that a netbook would be able to perform such heavy tasks.

The problem is Windows XP. The first netbooks were delivered with a customized version of Linux installed. Since the interface looked very different from Windows it was clear to most people that these were not full computers but companion devices. These devices sold well, even if they were not making a killing in the market like current netbooks are. The problem is that a lot of shops complained about Linux. Not on technical grounds, Linux is an excellent operating system and is ideally suited to netbooks, but more because it was unknown to most salesmen and consumer, and that it was difficult for an ignorant salesman to sell the OS to the ignorant consumer.

The netbooks manufacturers however had seen the potential of the small machines and decided to oblige the shops. They installed the machines with Windows XP. That's when things started to go wrong for the netbook concept. A lot of consumer made the equation: Windows equals full capacity laptop, so these netbooks are full laptops that are cheaper just because they are smaller. Of course the netbook manufacturers made a killing with these machines: who would not buy a $400 subnotebook! The problem is that these were not subnotebooks, and when they failed to play Far Cry 2or run software like PowerDirectoror Adobe Premiereproperly the returns started.

But by then the concept of the $400 mini laptopthat can replace your $700 laptophad become extremely popular, and killing it was not longer possible. What the netbooks manufacturers had condemned themselves to was selling mini laptops for $300 less than the laptops they used to sell. Also the real netbook concept of an ultra-portable companion machine to surf and perform simple tasks was getting lost in the rush to crank out better laptop replacement netbooks. These machines are better described as mini laptops and have little to do with the original netbook concept: they have larger 10 or 11 inch screen, large HDDs and more memory than required for netbook tasks.

Who can save the real netbook?

Some help is actually coming from Intel and Microsoft: Intel is now forbidding manufacturers to install Atom processors in machines with a screen bigger than 10 inches, meaning that tricking unsuspecting users into buying a netbook that looks like a full laptop won't be possible anymore. Microsoft also put severe limitations on the hardware of machines running Windows 7 starter edition, meaning that Windows mini laptop will become more expensive and will be better differentiated from real netbooks.

The biggest help for the true netbooks however will come from ARM and Linux. Manufacturers like Qualcomm are now releasing ARM based processors that are much better suited to true netbooks than the Atom processor. On the software side Linux distributions are gearing up to provide more netbook optimized interfaces and unlike Windows they will be compatible with the ARM architecture. Efforts like Ubuntu netbook remix, the HP MI interface,the Jolicloud operating system or even Google Android will soon result in a second generation of true netbooks than may end up killing the Windows based mini laptops, just like the mini laptops are now killing the first generation of netbooks.
 

WoodPeckr

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Kinda like them but the keyboards are too darn small.
 

danmand

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Kinda like them but the keyboards are too darn small.
Ilove mine. The screen is crystal clear and the keyboard is big enough for me.
I use a small wired mouse with it though.

PS: I only use it when travelling.
 

bishop

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This is a horrible article.

The netbook concept has been around for more than a decade. A POS device that runs a POS OS with POS functionality. It never caught on because the concept is a POS. I know because I have owned many of these POS devices, each time I think well maybe they have it right and maybe there will be a large app library but each time I am wrong. You need windows on a netbook, everyone knows this and the market reflects this, I think 98% of all netbooks now sold come with windows and not linux. It is not because manufacturers are forcing windows down the consumer's throat, initially netbooks came exclusively with linux, but they sold like sh*t until windows was available.

Stupid uneducated consumers are to blame for their expectations that a $200 netbook can play the latest games and encode HD video. I do not think anyone who buys a KIA is under the impression that it can compete with a porche just because it has 4 wheels and a gas pedal, that is common sense and that should also apply to netbooks.
 

danmand

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What model/make do you own?
An Acer Aspire one with Linpus light Linux.

The netbook concept has been around for more than a decade. A POS device that runs a POS OS with POS functionality. It never caught on because the concept is a POS. I know because I have owned many of these POS devices, each time I think well maybe they have it right and maybe there will be a large app library but each time I am wrong. You need windows on a netbook, everyone knows this and the market reflects this, I think 98% of all netbooks now sold come with windows and not linux.
I don't know why you are saying that.The acer comes with open office, firefox and a media player
installed. I treat the device as a black box, capable of browsing the internet and doing words, spreadsheets and
pictures.

I have refrained from changing anything at all on the device, I use it on travels, as a black box. I love it for
its small size and the capabilities it has. It boots in 9 seconds. No moving parts, fits in a jacket pocket.

I bought another one for a friend, and at the time, you could get XP on it for another $20, compared to the
linux lite. I declined. As someone else said, if you want a laptop, buy one. they are cheap now. But I would not
take a laptop with me, when I am going on vacation. I take my netbook, not my laptop.
 

ig-88

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Oct 28, 2006
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1) Vista laptops coming down to netbook price range

2) No optical drive

3) 1 GB RAM

4) It's not that much smaller ... and was a 12-14" laptop that big of a deal to carry around?

5) Still have to bring the power brick.

6) Hanging around in Starbucks pretending to work, while ogling mall chicks that won't give you the time of day ... gets old ... (and buy a $300 netbook just for that?) :confused:
 

Hobbyer

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This is a horrible article.

Stupid uneducated consumers are to blame for their expectations that a $200 netbook can play the latest games and encode HD video. I do not think anyone who buys a KIA is under the impression that it can compete with a porche just because it has 4 wheels and a gas pedal, that is common sense and that should also apply to netbooks.
Exactly. I think people forget what the NET in the word NETbook stands for. I bought mine to surf, you know, the interNET when mobile. For that it's perfect. It's a solid state HD with 2GB RAM and XP boots up in a flash (faster than my bloated i7 Vista by a mile). Everything runs fast fast fast, I can even play Warcraft 3, Diablo 2 no hitches. Battery life lasts 6 hours easy and I never carry the adapter, I mean what's the point, then it's no longer mobile. I use it for what it was designed for and it's great. Netbook + Tethering on iPhone = Unstoppable.

I've always believed that laptops in general are useless for real productivity. If you're on the move, you can't seriously be productive at anything that requires real horsepower. Don't bother encoding videos on any laptop, waste of time. Another funny thing is people I know that have laptops keep them at home 99% of time. And business people who use laptops 24/7 use em for MS Word, which also runs fine on a netbook. I was the only person I knew that went to grad school without a laptop, refused to buy into the hype despite being highly recommended by the program to get one. Still graduated with distinction over the fools who played online poker in class because they could. I mean, do you really need to type your essay in the courtyard? If you want to look at hot coeds, just do it, you don't need a laptop, lol.

IMO, cheap big clunky laptops are pieces of shit, I'd never own one. It's better to get a kick ass desktop to do real work, and a cheapo netbook for mobility surfing, typing emails, than to try to replciate desktop power on a top grade laptop which would cost a fortune and still yield a less powerful machine.

If you want real power get a desktop, if you want real mobility get a netbook. It's the laptop that fits in nowhere.
 

djk

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I view notebooks as the office or home computer you can effortlessly move with you. Most consumers really don't need desktops, IMO.

Netbooks were meant to serve as a extension of that experience but in a better form factor and less cost. I think that's why so many people are commenting negatively about them. They watch HD video, encode stuff, rip DVD's, etc on their laptop. They expect a similar experience on the netbook.

They see the company logos, the intel logo, the windows logo and think -- hey, it's like my notebook, just smaller and cheaper. OEM's, Intel and MS haven't done a good job of explaining the differences (yet?).

Also with Windows 7, you're going to see prices rise. MS wants XP dead badly as they're losing money. A XP license is cheaper than a Windows 7 one. I wouldn't be surprised to hear XP OEM licensing to cease within a year, maybe two.

I think as smartphone have started to really evolved (and will continue) in the last two years (thanks, iPhone!), netbooks are going to slide into oblivion.
 

Cobra Enorme

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Exactly. I think people forget what the NET in the word NETbook stands for. I bought mine to surf, you know, the interNET when mobile. For that it's perfect. It's a solid state HD with 2GB RAM and XP boots up in a flash (faster than my bloated i7 Vista by a mile). Everything runs fast fast fast, I can even play Warcraft 3, Diablo 2 no hitches. Battery life lasts 6 hours easy and I never carry the adapter, I mean what's the point, then it's no longer mobile. I use it for what it was designed for and it's great. Netbook + Tethering on iPhone = Unstoppable.

I've always believed that laptops in general are useless for real productivity. If you're on the move, you can't seriously be productive at anything that requires real horsepower. Don't bother encoding videos on any laptop, waste of time. Another funny thing is people I know that have laptops keep them at home 99% of time. And business people who use laptops 24/7 use em for MS Word, which also runs fine on a netbook. I was the only person I knew that went to grad school without a laptop, refused to buy into the hype despite being highly recommended by the program to get one. Still graduated with distinction over the fools who played online poker in class because they could. I mean, do you really need to type your essay in the courtyard? If you want to look at hot coeds, just do it, you don't need a laptop, lol.

IMO, cheap big clunky laptops are pieces of shit, I'd never own one. It's better to get a kick ass desktop to do real work, and a cheapo netbook for mobility surfing, typing emails, than to try to replciate desktop power on a top grade laptop which would cost a fortune and still yield a less powerful machine.

If you want real power get a desktop, if you want real mobility get a netbook. It's the laptop that fits in nowhere.
incredible post, bang on
 

WoodPeckr

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Also with Windows 7, you're going to see prices rise. MS wants XP dead badly as they're losing money. A XP license is cheaper than a Windows 7 one. I wouldn't be surprised to hear XP OEM licensing to cease within a year, maybe two.
The reason XP was brought back from a death sentence by M$ was Linux!
When M$ saw all them netbooks coming in with Linux, they decided to extend XP awhile. M$ feared once people get a taste of how easy Linux is, they may dump M$. To avoid this M$ started loading all them netbooks with XP, a known OS rather than take a chance on people using Linux and liking what they found.
 

bishop

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The Atom used in current netbooks are plenty powerful, it is comparable in speed to a pentium M 1ghz that was the at the heart of many Intel centrino based notebooks about 4-5 years ago. The only thing that has change in the last 5 years is the demand for HD and the increase in resource intensive 3d games. Word processing, excel, email, solitare, porn sites, etc... have not changed much in the last 5 years in terms to demand for more computational horsepower, generally speaking. Those who complain about the slowness of a netbook, are trying to use a netbook for stuff that even most fully blown laptops will have a problem with, 3D gaming and HD video.

I have a netbook, I do not use it, I prefer my laptop because of the bigger KB and bigger screen. It has nothing to do with the computational horsepower and windows.
 

bishop

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An Acer Aspire one with Linpus light Linux.



I don't know why you are saying that.The acer comes with open office, firefox and a media player
installed. I treat the device as a black box, capable of browsing the internet and doing words, spreadsheets and
pictures.

I have refrained from changing anything at all on the device, I use it on travels, as a black box. I love it for
its small size and the capabilities it has. It boots in 9 seconds. No moving parts, fits in a jacket pocket.

I bought another one for a friend, and at the time, you could get XP on it for another $20, compared to the
linux lite. I declined. As someone else said, if you want a laptop, buy one. they are cheap now. But I would not
take a laptop with me, when I am going on vacation. I take my netbook, not my laptop.
There were already linux/windows ce based mini laptops before "netbooks", but they did not gain popularity. The only thing that "netbooks" did that was different was the ability to run windows with a low price and small size.

For many people linux is enough most of the time, but certainly there will be times when you need use a piece of software that is available only in windows, or run a USB device; scanner, printer, joystick, tv tuner, etc... that has no linux support (most USB devices have no linux support)

I feel that netbooks are too powerful to be held back by Linux, not that Linux is garbage but the amount of available software and device drivers is very limiting. You are not going to have as wonderful of an experience running windows on a netbook as you would running windows on a laptop, but that is no reason to throw the entire windows experience out the window and limit yourself to what is available with Linux.

I am really disappointed in Linux WRT netbooks, netbooks were the perfect battleground for Linux to kick the sh*t out of windows but Linux got crushed, indeed it looks like Linux surrendered without firing a shot. If linux can not win on a platform that is resource constrained and lowcost, it can not win on any meaningful battleground (not considering mission critical applications and exotic number crunching applications). The Strength of Linux is it's biggest weakness, there is no ownership, no pride, no one is going to bang heads with MS if they feel that someone else might pickup the sword and shed blood in their place.
 

djk

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The reason XP was brought back from a death sentence by M$ was Linux!
When M$ saw all them netbooks coming in with Linux, they decided to extend XP awhile. M$ feared once people get a taste of how easy Linux is, they may dump M$. To avoid this M$ started loading all them netbooks with XP, a known OS rather than take a chance on people using Linux and liking what they found.
I think that was MS' original concern but their fears were unfounded. I disagree with Linux being as easy as Windows or OS X.

So did the market.

http://blog.laptopmag.com/msi-wind-coming-to-major-retailer-new-models-coming-soon

They start playing around with Linux and start realizing that it’s not what they are used to. They don’t want to spend time to learn it so they bring it back to the store. The return rate is at least four times higher for Linux netbooks than Windows XP netbooks.
 

danmand

Well-known member
Nov 28, 2003
46,972
5,600
113
Exactly. I think people forget what the NET in the word NETbook stands for. I bought mine to surf, you know, the interNET when mobile. For that it's perfect. It's a solid state HD with 2GB RAM and XP boots up in a flash (faster than my bloated i7 Vista by a mile). Everything runs fast fast fast, I can even play Warcraft 3, Diablo 2 no hitches. Battery life lasts 6 hours easy and I never carry the adapter, I mean what's the point, then it's no longer mobile. I use it for what it was designed for and it's great. Netbook + Tethering on iPhone = Unstoppable.

I've always believed that laptops in general are useless for real productivity. If you're on the move, you can't seriously be productive at anything that requires real horsepower. Don't bother encoding videos on any laptop, waste of time. Another funny thing is people I know that have laptops keep them at home 99% of time. And business people who use laptops 24/7 use em for MS Word, which also runs fine on a netbook. I was the only person I knew that went to grad school without a laptop, refused to buy into the hype despite being highly recommended by the program to get one. Still graduated with distinction over the fools who played online poker in class because they could. I mean, do you really need to type your essay in the courtyard? If you want to look at hot coeds, just do it, you don't need a laptop, lol.

IMO, cheap big clunky laptops are pieces of shit, I'd never own one. It's better to get a kick ass desktop to do real work, and a cheapo netbook for mobility surfing, typing emails, than to try to replciate desktop power on a top grade laptop which would cost a fortune and still yield a less powerful machine.

If you want real power get a desktop, if you want real mobility get a netbook. It's the laptop that fits in nowhere.
This is exactly what I was trying to say. Thanks
 

WoodPeckr

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I think that was MS' original concern but their fears were unfounded. I disagree with Linux being as easy as Windows or OS X.
They start playing around with Linux and start realizing that it’s not what they are used to. They don’t want to spend time to learn it so they bring it back to the store. The return rate is at least four times higher for Linux netbooks than Windows XP netbooks.
They just don't want to learn Linux.
Usually the first thing they ask is can I use my M$ apps?...:rolleyes:

I played around with a that Acer with Linpus light Linux. Took about 10 minutes to figure it out. It's a simple Linux distro that performs as expected and what it was designed for. Because it looks different to those used to XP which has been around forever, many people just don't want to bother learning it.

IMHO it's the same as the first time I tried out a Mac. Everything seemed strange being so used to M$ but once you figured out how it's laid out it's not that hard to adjust to. There are many people using Windows that don't know how it's laid out and XP was really a simple OS only ~5GB in size.

A Netbook with an atom CPU and 1 GB of RAM will run XP fine but if you put just about any Linux distro in that same netbook and it will fly much faster!
 
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