Are you all gonna get mad a Barbara Kay as well?

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wigglee

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Aardvark154 said:
So is the Queen.
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really?.....how many nationalities does she hold? I thought one had to actually reside here for a time to acquire citizenship, but I guess the bitty is also Sri Lankan, Trinidadian, Nigerian, Kenyan, Jamaican, Fijian, Zambian, Maltese and Samoan, amongst many others.......isn't that "special"?
 
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d_jedi

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Whether you agreed with him or not, Jack Layton dedicated himself to fighting for those things he believed in, and gave his life to public service.
I don't know if a state funeral is mandated by protocol or whatnot, but I can see no reason why not to grant him this honour.
 
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Lord_Rambures

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Aardvark154 said:
So is the Queen.
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Is the Queen a Canadian citizen? How on earth could the Queen be a Canadian citizen? She cannot be a subject of herself. She is the Queen of Canada, she is the embodiment or personification of the state, so in law the Queen is Canada. She is not the citizen of any country in the world.
 
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Lord_Rambures

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Aardvark154 said:
Actually she's at Balmoral at present.

So we should all be quiet for a week in deference to Jack Layton. But you can call the Sovereign an "old bag," talk about a double standard.
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wigglee said:
when she dies, I shall refrain from calling her an old bag for one week.......isn't that fair?
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Exactly, you took the words out of my mouth. Jack Layton can no longer respond to criticisms leveled at him. The Queen, if she saw fit, could come on the board and respond - see the difference?
 
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fuji

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masterchief said:
Okay, but based on that criteria he shouldn't since at the time of his death he was no longer in that role, he stepped down a while back.
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No he didn't. He was still the sitting Leader of the Opposition at the time of his death. He had appointed an interim to stand in his place, but he still held the role officially.
 
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fuji

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Mervyn said:
I brought the BQ opposition leaders name into it because if Jack Layton gets a state Funeral (which again I am fine with) that sets a precedence and potential expectation that other Opposition leaders will get one.
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A sitting Leader of the Opposition has precedence over even sitting Premiers in all matters of protocol. It's not wishy washy. There is a list. The Leader of the Opposition is 8th in precedence officially, and 14th if you enumerate out the various roles that are included in the previous 7 categories. A State Funeral is a matter of protocol. It's hard to imagine that he would NOT get one, given the formal precedence that goes with being the Leader of the Opposition, living at Stornoway.
 
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fuji

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Aardvark154

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Lord_Rambures said:
Is the Queen a Canadian citizen? How on earth could the Queen be a Canadian citizen? She cannot be a subject of herself. She is the Queen of Canada, she is the embodiment or personification of the state, so in law the Queen is Canada. She is not the citizen of any country in the world.
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On a legal level you are entirely correct. However she is still a Canadian.

Note that I never used the word Citizen in #63.
 
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thompo69

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fuji said:
A sitting Leader of the Opposition has precedence over even sitting Premiers in all matters of protocol. It's not wishy washy. There is a list. The Leader of the Opposition is 8th in precedence officially, and 14th if you enumerate out the various roles that are included in the previous 7 categories. A State Funeral is a matter of protocol. It's hard to imagine that he would NOT get one, given the formal precedence that goes with being the Leader of the Opposition, living at Stornoway.
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I'm sorry "14th if you enumerate out the various roles"? By my count there are 54, if you don't include the diplomatic corps, which would add about 100 or so.
 
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GPIDEAL

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fuji said:
Kay is an idiot who knows nothing about Canadian precedence and protocol. She should visit this page:

http://www.pch.gc.ca/pgm/ceem-cced/prtcl/precedence-eng.cfm

The sitting Leader of Her Majesty's Loyal Opposition is 8th order of precedence in Canada, in all matters of protocol behind cabinet ministers but ahead of Provincial Premiers and Lieutenant Governors. Given that high status in all matters of protocol it is ridiculous to argue no state funeral should be given. It's worse than saying that a state funeral should be denied to a sitting Premier who dies in office.

Absolutely ridiculous!

Whatever you may think of Jack Layton as a person you ought to have respect for Canadian traditions.
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Yes, and you know what they say - you can't fuck with tradition!
 
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GPIDEAL

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masterchief said:
My analogy was not about being able to refuse a state funeral, but the fact that the comparison was being made to a former Prime Minister to an MP in regards to being equal in recieving the honors of a state funeral and of laying in state.

We are not a democracy since we do not elect our Head of State. We may have democratic ideals, but as long as that position is appointed (By God for the Monarch and the PM for the GG) we are a constitutional monarchy
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... and a parliamentary democracy. To say that Canada isn't a democracy is utterly absurd.
 
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