Did You Get The Flu Shot This Year?

[MRBJX]

How did Big Pharma loose it's way? Yes there have been mistakes and some problems, but I will tell you in my family alone many lives would have been shortened or made far less palatable with medicines developed by Big Pharma, many cancers, Parkinsons, severe arthritis, dementia, cronic pain, severe infections, pneumonia, severe tropical diseases, have all been added by the medicine outré modern scientists have developed, all at very reasonable cost if at all and with no risk of a lack of supply and sorry for my many fans none of these belong to me

Considering what life would like with out pharmacology today, the scale is no where near the negative side.

Yes, we are less tough than our ancestors, but on the plus side we live longer and more comfortably.

Can't see the the forest for the trees eh?

Not so long ago death rates and incidence of measles, smallpox, polio, yellow fever etc where very high, something had to be done - this was not for profit, but to help people after all they the scientists themselves could very soon die from any.

Today, the death rate for the flu isn't even close to any of the aforementioned, in fact its a best guess that errs on the side of assigning more deaths to the flu than actually counting them properly. It is very difficult to prove whether the flu vaccine for the particular year is effective, its almost futile, it doesn't work at all the same in different people, and its formulated on the best guess of what flu may have it's 15mins of fame. It's really a scientific farce that the community should be embarassed of. It is NOTHING like the vaccines that actually helped the human race...or did they help us? Did they bring about a plethora of small side-effects? (Despite the side effects that we may be seeing, they should be taken, but as such more research must go into understanding long term effects and that plain doesn't happen, money goes into what the next product is going to be, the next patch.

Medicine today is not interested in a cure, there's no money in a cure, to appease any shareholder and pay the salaries for people to live. So a new game exists, its the keep them out of the hospital game, and the government will pay for it, or in some cases private health care, hedging its bets that if you can take a substance that might keep you out of the hospital then financially the government is better off, but there is no strong evidence that the flu shot does anything.
Side effects be damned. A real cure or a real understanding be cursed.

A yearly flu vaccine is bad science, bad medicine and un-necessary but its good for the pocket books of pharma.

 

[MRBJX]

That one line pretty much sums up your ignorance of vaccines.

Why thank you

 

[MRBJX]

I missed that one. MRBJX, vaccines do nothing for you if you have the disease, never have.

yep - so as the "pandemic begins" oooo ahhh o noees....it makes a tonne of sense for those folks in edmonton to line up, only actually have any antibodies 3 weeks later

Oh yea, i forgot, take it just in case !

 

[fuji]

You say that as if it is a certainty. It is possible but it might not.

p.s. H1N1 and H5N1 are not specific strains of they flu, they are general categories and each one is constantly mutating. That is why people can get the flu more than once.

It is a certainty that there will eventually be a strain of HPAI A(H5N1) that can spread human to human, unless some vaccine prevents it from happening, which currently seems unlikely given its pandemic global spread among multiple bird species.

Whether that results in a serious human pandemic, or whether we can contain it with an effective vaccine, remains to be seen.

 

[fuji]

yep - so as the "pandemic begins" oooo ahhh o noees....it makes a tonne of sense for those folks in edmonton to line up, only actually have any antibodies 3 weeks later

Oh yea, i forgot, take it just in case !

You haven't got a clue what you are talking about.

Vaccinating people is an effective block against a pandemic even where only a fraction of the population vaccinate, and it's only two weeks, not three, and that is ample time.

 

[MRBJX]

You haven't got a clue what you are talking about.

Vaccinating people is an effective block against a pandemic even where only a fraction of the population vaccinate, and it's only two weeks, not three, and that is ample time.

We're talking about the flu here smartie pants, not small pox, there's a pretty HUGE difference in virulence and mortality.
I'm sure you have seen the data on antibody titers vs time for the current lott of "vaccines", and their immunogenicity, after all you can time travel, and I'm sure you've done the math including the Poisson distribution, on the how the ~60% efficacy of the flu vaccine coupled with a feeble mortality rate with the peak season of 3 months warrants global almost mandatory vaccination, yearly.

Oh and if you didn't know, which apparently you don't, so I'll tell you there is no current pandemic involving H1N1 or even one looming on the horizon.

Two weeks eh? yea if you exercise a lot maybe, show me the data on 2 weeks and I'll eat my shoe, but I know you are only quoting some best case marketing B.S. you read from somewhere.

 

[blackrock13]

We're talking about the flu here smartie pants, not small pox, there's a pretty HUGE difference in virulence and mortality.
I'm sure you have seen the data on antibody titers vs time for the current lott of "vaccines", and their immunogenicity, after all you can time travel, and I'm sure you've done the math including the Poisson distribution, on the how the ~60% efficacy of the flu vaccine coupled with a feeble mortality rate with the peak season of 3 months warrants global almost mandatory vaccination, yearly.

Oh and if you didn't know, which apparently you don't, so I'll tell you there is no current pandemic involving H1N1 or even one looming on the horizon.

Two weeks eh? yea if you exercise a lot maybe, show me the data on 2 weeks and I'll eat my shoe, but I know you are only quoting some best case marketing B.S. you read from somewhere.

You are correct, no pandemic has been declared for H1N1 but that doesn't take away the effectiveness of as many as possible getting the shot, even at this late date, because of something known as a second wave of infection. Then what you get a spike in the the late November or so and can get another spike in late January or so.

The data, will the CDC suffice, since they don't sell drugs?

There are now new tools to track the flu.
The CDC is watching social media flu sites such as Google Flu Tracker, and a Facebook app tries to identify the “friend” that gave you the flu from its searches and comments.
Flunearyou.org has 20,000 volunteers who are tracking their symptoms, narrowing the spread of flu down to your ZIP code.
An office hot spot? The elevator. One sneeze can spray the flu — in droplets — up to 20 feet, coating the doors and buttons. And what do you touch in an elevator? The buttons.
The CDC suggests washing your hands and getting a flu shot — still available and effective within two weeks.
If you get sick, cover your cough and sneeze with your elbow, not your hand so you are less likely to spread the virus.
Those at high risk for severe disease — young children, seniors, pregnant women, those with medical problems — should see their doctor. Antiviral drugs might prevent your illness from getting worse.

http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/health/2013/01/07/flu-outbreak-fighting-the-virus-with-social-media/


May I suggest a gumboot, they last longer.

The mortality rate of some strains of flu is anything but feeble, as mention earlier H5N1, nearly 60%. Globally there is anything even approaching a mandatory vaccination program. some regions can approach 60% where other large regions approach single digits. Even with the high penetration rate of inoculation as they have in the US, nearly 200 million, the last major flu out break had ~40,000 hospitalization and ~2000 deaths.

 

[Ridgeman08]

Exactly

We're talking about the flu here smartie pants, not small pox, there's a pretty HUGE difference in virulence and mortality.
I'm sure you have seen the data on antibody titers vs time for the current lott of "vaccines", and their immunogenicity, after all you can time travel, and I'm sure you've done the math including the Poisson distribution, on the how the ~60% efficacy of the flu vaccine coupled with a feeble mortality rate with the peak season of 3 months warrants global almost mandatory vaccination, yearly.

Oh and if you didn't know, which apparently you don't, so I'll tell you there is no current pandemic involving H1N1 or even one looming on the horizon.

Two weeks eh? yea if you exercise a lot maybe, show me the data on 2 weeks and I'll eat my shoe, but I know you are only quoting some best case marketing B.S. you read from somewhere.

Thanks for chiming in and saying (way better than I could, BTW) what I've been trying to...

Internet Geniuses like Fuji and Blackrock always take peoples words, twist them around, and use them to say something completely different in order to make an (often irrelevant) point. (Case in point: I say something negative about a flu shot, and suddenly they are talking about small pox, measels, Hepatitis etc. :crazy

As for their "data" on mortality rates due to "the flu", you are correct in saying is highly subjective... because most of those deaths are from people with predisposed health issues.

 

[fuji]

We're talking about the flu here smartie pants, not small pox, there's a pretty HUGE difference in virulence and mortality.

Depends on the strain. Spanish flu mortality was quite high.

 

[fuji]

As for their "data" on mortality rates due to "the flu", you are correct in saying is highly subjective... because most of those deaths are from people with predisposed health issues.

Depends again on the strain. H1N1 variants tend to kill primarily younger, healthy people. Regular seasonal flu kills weaker people primarily as you say.

 

[blackrock13]

Thanks for chiming in and saying (way better than I could, BTW) what I've been trying to...

Internet Geniuses like Fuji and Blackrock always take peoples words, twist them around, and use them to say something completely different in order to make an (often irrelevant) point. (Case in point: I say something negative about a flu shot, and suddenly they are talking about small pox, measels, Hepatitis etc. :crazy

As for their "data" on mortality rates due to "the flu", you are correct in saying is highly subjective... because most of those deaths are from people with predisposed health issues.

When 'the people' are the CDC,the WHO, or even Health Canada, I'll accept their take on things medical more often than most anything you say.

You last statement is so foolish. Predisposed or not, people die as a result of the addition of having the flu. It accelerated, amplified, contributed, or gave rise to complication, however you want to express it. That's why older folks are more susceptible to certain strains. The data is not as subjective as you would like others to believe, as the variations were noted earlier, with treated and untreated results.

 

[danmand]

Depends again on the strain. H1N1 variants tend to kill primarily younger, healthy people. Regular seasonal flu kills weaker people primarily as you say.

The real problem is, in my opinion, that the flu vaccines protect against last years flu. That is generally a good thing, and I personally would not miss taking it. However, the real danger to us is the emergence of a new, virulent flu, for example if the bird flu mutates into an easily transmittable flu.

 

[blackrock13]

The real problem is, in my opinion, that the flu vaccines protect against last years flu. That is generally a good thing, and I personally would not miss taking it. However, the real danger to us is the emergence of a new, virulent flu, for example if the bird flu mutates into an easily transmittable flu.

You're not as well informed as you would like us to think, although we realize it's just your opinion. It's pretty basic stuff to start. From wiki; http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Influenza_vaccine

The influenza vaccination is an annual vaccination using a vaccine specific for a given year to protect against the highly variable influenza virus.[1] Each seasonal influenza vaccine contains antigens representing three (trivalent vaccine) or four (quadrivalent vaccine) influenza virus strains: one influenza type A subtype H1N1 virus strain, one influenza type A subtype H3N2 virus strain, and either one or two influenza type B virus strains.[2] Influenza vaccines may be administered as an injection, also known as a flu shot, or as a nasal spray.

They choose the most likely or most virulent candidates based on all sorts of data, including but not exclusively from 'last year'. The vaccines can also protect against other strains not specifically targeted.

 

[IM469]

The headlines you posted are false?

The headlines are there - the stories are there - but according to many virus specialists on this thread - it is a ploy of the pharmaceutical companies. Maybe the H1N1 deaths are miss diagnosed snake bites.

 

[blackrock13]

The headlines are there - the stories are there - but according to many virus specialists on this thread - it is a ploy of the pharmaceutical companies. Maybe the H1N1 deaths are miss diagnosed snake bites.

Gotcha :thumb:

 

[great bear]

Gotcha, now I'm going to bore you to death :thumb:

Fixed your thread Blackcrock, thank me later.

 

[Ridgeman08]

Fixed your thread Blackcrock, thank me later.

Too late... :frusty:

 

[blackrock13]

Fixed your thread Blackcrock, thank me later.

Except that isn't what I posted. As usual, you clearly can't add something constructive to the thread topic, so you just entertain yourself and a select few with small time BB masterbation. Well done.

 

[great bear]

Except that isn't what I posted. As usual, you clearly can't add something constructive to the thread topic, so you just entertain yourself and a select few with small time BB masterbation. Well done.

zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz.

 

[blackrock13]

zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz.

Standard response from a small mind, it is the season for the hairy snoozers, keep up the good work cubby.