Getting hydroxychloroquine

PornAddict

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I am not going to pretend like I read everything you said above. No one said remdesevir is a miracle drug. People including my self said it was promising. It has the same potential as hcq I’d you looked at the pre clinical studies minus the trump thing.


Also just browsing through your post you seem to be questioning the New England Journal of Medicine which is the highest level of medical literature .... in favour of alt right opinion sites. Yes I won’t continue reading.

People need to realize that experts who’ve spent 18 years studying this know better. There is experience. You keep claiming RCT RCT. You have no idea how do design a RCT or what it’s benefits are. Leave it to the experts. Also people who have been studying drugs for a while and not just focusing on this drug or coming off political websites can tell you from experience how this process works. It is VERY rare for large observational studies to show no effect and a RCT to come along and prove everything wrong. RCTs can have errors and more importantly they can be underpowered to make conclusions beyond the sample.


All I am saying is let the medical experts do what they do and not listen to political websites on medical matters.

Is long so just read this paragraph in blue!
Just look at last highlights in blue paragraph below and answer the question!
Even my your own admission from your previous posting above about 5% of Facebook polling by medical doctor.That 5% of medical doctor do that HCQ as a preventative medicine against covid19.

Answers these questions. Honestly answer these questions !

1. Do you have a HCQ prescription for any of your family members or close friends? Do you have your own supply of HCQ?
2. Are you presently taking HCQ as a preventative medicine against Covid19?

3. If you for some reason at the first symptoms of covid19 ( example losing sense of small or taste) or a sign of flu symptoms would you considered taking HCQ with zpak and Zinc?

4. Would you even consider taking HCQ?

5. And do you know any of your medical colleagues presently taking HCQ?

6. Do you know any of your medical colleagues that confided in you about they would consider taking HCQ if there aren't any better drugs that are available or vaccines available
?

7. And why are doctor hoarding HCQ?


https://www.propublica.org/article/...escriptions-for-themselves-and-their-families


Answer above questions honestly!
Do your hypocrate oath mean anything to you?
Remember your hypocrate oath!


If you can look yourself in the mirror after answering these truthfully 7 questions I posed then your doctor so called expert opinions will hold more weight to me!! I reserved the right to change my mind if the new data , hopefully double blinded studies come out disproving all naysayers of HCQ or those suffer TDS ( Hate anything from the right / conservative view point).

I will only follow or believe in randomly double blinded studies, because it the Gold Standard. Any thing less in my opinion is just excuse & excuse! Random Double blinded studied or not expensive probably the same cost as a random controlled trial. I can see no extra cost involvement of not letting the patients or doctor know that they are giving a placebo or a drug/ vaccine!


Majority of medical Doctors have integrity and Honesty in their moral value but you do a few bad apple example (WHO , others) !
So Again Please answer the above 7 questions I posted to you!
 
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Valcazar

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Hang on a second.
Are you under the impression that people are trying to prevent anyone from studying HCQ?

There are a bunch of studies underway.
 

Ben19

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Where is your evidence doctors are hoarding this medication and prescribing it to them selves. Also hcq is literally one of the most studied topics and that’s in it self a tragedy as the money could be used in other things.

A guy who only accepts level 1 RCT as evidence is now making up claims about doctors hoarding HCQ for them selves. If doctors prescribed and horded every single medication that had a positive response in one shitty study they’d be filled with drugs. You gotta keep in mind for you this hcq is the only thing but for real doctors they deal with lots of diseases and lots of drugs this ain’t the first time they e seen drugs go through this period of ying Yang with early data.


You’re statement is frankly offensive to physicians implying they are purposefully withholding meds to people to give it to themselves ? I know a lot I mean a lot of actual doctors and none of them are taking this. Only physicians I’ve seen come out in support of this have ties with alt right political sides. The science is not there yet.
 

PornAddict

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Where is your evidence doctors are hoarding this medication and prescribing it to them selves.
https://www.propublica.org/article/...escriptions-for-themselves-and-their-families

Answers all this 7 questions!

1. Do you have a HCQ prescription for any of your family members or close friends? Do you have your own supply of HCQ? You found this question offensive, so I have to think Your reponsible would be No!

2. Are you presently taking HCQ as a preventative medicine against Covid19?
Based on the above post I have to guess your not taking covid19 as a preventive medicine against covid19.
But I would prefer you answer this question directly!


3. If you for some reason at the first early symptoms ( Before incubation or before ICU stage) of covid19 ( example losing sense of smell or taste or any sign of flu symptoms ... Would you considered taking HCQ with zpak and Zinc? Right at this very moment you strongly supect you came down with covid19... So would you take HCQ with Zpak and zinc ?

You did not answer this question #3 !




4. Would you even ever consider taking HCQ?
Guess based on your post . It probably maybe NO !


5. And do you know any of your medical colleagues presently taking HCQ?
Your answer is No


6. Do you know any of your medical colleagues that confided in you about they would consider taking HCQ if there aren't any better drugs that are available or vaccines aren't available [/B]?
Based on your posting your Answer is No for the first part of the question but You never answer the second part of the question!

7. And why are doctor hoarding HCQ?
Your is answer: The question is offensive. Where is the proof that medical doctor is hoarding HCQ?


https://www.propublica.org/article/...escriptions-for-themselves-and-their-families


Doctors Are Hoarding Unproven Coronavirus Medicine by Writing Prescriptions for Themselves and Their Families
Pharmacists told ProPublica that they are seeing unusual and fraudulent prescribing activity as doctors stockpile unproven coronavirus drugs endorsed by President Donald Trump.


PS . It a tragedy that a properly design Simple double blinded random control trial for HCQ not designed because of politic ( suffering from TDS ).
 

Ben19

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https://www.propublica.org/article/...escriptions-for-themselves-and-their-families

Answers all this 7 questions!

1. Do you have a HCQ prescription for any of your family members or close friends? Do you have your own supply of HCQ? Your reponsible would be No

2. Are you presently taking HCQ as a preventative medicine against Covid19?
Based on the above post I have to guess your not taking covid19 as a preventive medicine against covid19.
But I would prefer you answer this question directly!


3. If you for some reason at the first symptoms of covid19 ( example losing sense of small or tasteor a sign of flu symptoms would you considered taking HCQ with zpak and Zinc?
You did not answer thus question!


4. Would you even consider taking HCQ?
Guess based on your post . No answer!


5. And do you know any of your medical colleagues presently taking HCQ?
Your answer is No


6. Do you know any of your medical colleagues that confided in you about they would consider taking HCQ if there aren't any better drugs that are available or vaccines aren't available [/B]?
Based on your posting your Answer is No

7. And why are doctor hoarding HCQ?
Your is answer: The question is offensive. Where is the proof that medical doctor is hoarding HCQ?


https://www.propublica.org/article/...escriptions-for-themselves-and-their-families


Doctors Are Hoarding Unproven Coronavirus Medicine by Writing Prescriptions for Themselves and Their Families
Pharmacists told ProPublica that they are seeing unusual and fraudulent prescribing activity as doctors stockpile unproven coronavirus drugs endorsed by President Donald Trump.


PS . It a tragedy that a properly design Simple double blinded random control trial for HCQ not designed because of politic ( suffering from TDS ).
WHAT?!

You are citing a poll posted on an ALT right website as evidence yet you go around saying Only Multi-Center double blind Randomized Controll Trials whenever someone cites a paper against HCQ.... give me a fucking break
 

PornAddict

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WHAT?!

You are citing a poll posted on an ALT right website as evidence yet you go around saying Only Multi-Center double blind Randomized Controll Trials whenever someone cites a paper against HCQ.... give me a fucking break

For your info I never cited a poll on double blinded studies for any website questionly a randomly controlled trial some cites against HCQ!
By the ways the above 7 questions those posted on the above or my original design question not from some alt right website!
Note all my orginal questions have full of grammar errors, and English is not my mother to tongue!

I used my basic knowledge in biostatistics and Advance statistics and ask a valid question ! Where a a double blinded studies on a randomly control trial?

You suddenly show your true Colours by suddenly demonize my valid question ?
Also you did not answer questions #3 ????
And then I proved to you that some doctors are writing a prescription for HCQ for themselves and family members!
See above link I posted!

GIVE ME A #%$! BREAK?

Let agree to disagree!
You proved to me that your biased against conservative view! I am simply questioning any RCT that dont included " double blinded " parameter then suddenly I am having an alt right view!
I follow where the data !
If data for a double blinded randomly control trial says you are right then I will end the subject.
I would happily agree with that results!
By your own admission you even admitted on previous post that a large sample RCT without ( double blinded parameters) can have rare errors!

The double blinded random contol trial will proves that there are no confirmation biased!
You of all people should understand confirmation biases!
You certainly show your true Colours by demonize or labelling anyone that question random control HCQ studies as alt rights!
For your info I am not alt right .. I hate fucking Gov't ( left or right)! FUckTrump, Fuck Trudeau, Fuck NDP, Fuck Liberals, Fuck Repilicans!



Your the one who post a RCT from lancelets on HCQ and said that HCQ don't work! I question the studies by asking a basic question ! WHere is a double blinded randomly studies? Where is the zinc ? How come they don't use zinc? It so easy to measure the zinc level in the blood!
But guess this so called expert didn't want to design a double blinded randomly trial and don't want to include the zinc in the trial.
You need a double blinded studies...
In order to prevent Confirmation biases! How do I know that you not suffering from TDS Or any other Doctor suffer from TDS?
! It obviously you show a confirmation biases against HCQ!








3. If you for some reason at the first early symptoms ( Before incubation or before ICU stage) of covid19 ( example losing sense of smell or taste or any sign of flu symptoms ... Would you considered taking HCQ with zpak and Zinc? Right at this very moment you strongly supect you came down with covid19... So would you take HCQ with Zpak and zinc ?

You did not answer this question #3 !


PPS. Answer fucking questions #3 ?
 

Ben19

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For your info I never cited a poll on double blinded studies for any website questionly a randomly controlled trial some cites against HCQ!
I used my basic knowledge in biostatistics and Advance statistics and ask a valid question ! Where a a double blinded studies on a randomly control trial?

You suddenly show your true Colours by suddenly demonize my valid question ?
Also you did not answer questions #3 ????
And then I proved to you that some doctors are writing a prescription for HCQ for themselves and family members!
See above link I posted!

GIVE ME A #%$! BREAK?

Let agree to disagree!
You proved to me that your biased against conservative view! I am simply anyone question authority then suddenly I am having an alt right view!
I follow where the data !
If data for a double blinded randomly control trial says you are right then I will end the subject.
I would happily agree with that results!
By your own admission you even admitted on previous post that a RCT can have small errors!
The double blinded random contol trial will proves that there are no confirmation biased!
You of all people should understand confirmation biases!
You certainly show your true Colours by demonize or labelling anyone that question random control HCQ studies as alt rights!
For your info I am not alt right .. I hate fucking Gov't ( left or right)! FUckTrump, Fuck Trudeau, Fuck NDP, Fuck Liberals, Fuck Repilicans!



Your the one who post a RCT from lancelets on HCQ and said that HCQ don't work! I question the studies by asking a basic question ! WHere is a double blinded randomly studies? In order to prevent
Confirmation biases! It obviously you show a confirmation biases against HCQ!








3. If you for some reason at the first early symptoms ( Before incubation or before ICU stage) of covid19 ( example losing sense of smell or taste or any sign of flu symptoms ... Would you considered taking HCQ with zpak and Zinc? Right at this very moment you strongly supect you came down with covid19... So would you take HCQ with Zpak and zinc ?

You did not answer this question #3 !


PPS. Answer fucking questions #3 ?
Answer to your question 3 is based on current evidence available in the medical literature (ie not youtube videos). I will not take HCQ and not recommend anyone to do so either. If however someone wishes to do so I don think they should be stopped as long as they understand all the risks.



I am telling you based on my experience and experience of anyone who is not a "expert" on political sites, anytime there is THIS much evidence against something with some evidence towards it the efficacy is very low. We can both agree given the lancet paper and chinese RCTs there is pretty good evidence against the use of HCQ now the question becomes what is the evidence for it that a double blinded study is gonna magically save? Even if a double blinded RCT comes out it likely will not have statistical power calculations to reverse any real experts decision it will just prolong the controversy. This is not my first rodeo with pharmaceuticals, this drug clearly either has no effect or a VERY small one and when there is this much bias towards it we will never get a real answer as to what exactly the effect is since there will be gas lighting on both sides. I would personally invest my energy on immunological therapies and vaccines.

Its funny HCQ is literally studied with any new virus and everytime its the same shit that goes on and every time eventually its shown that it is not effective but this time one political side has just taken over and its no longer about the science.
 

PornAddict

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Answer to your question 3 is based on current evidence available in the medical literature (ie not youtube videos). I will not take HCQ and not recommend anyone to do so either. If however someone wishes to do so I don think they should be stopped as long as they understand all the risks.



I am telling you based on my experience and experience of anyone who is not a "expert" on political sites, anytime there is THIS much evidence against something with some evidence towards it the efficacy is very low. We can both agree given the lancet paper and chinese RCTs there is pretty good evidence against the use of HCQ now the question becomes what is the evidence for it that a double blinded study is gonna magically save? Even if a double blinded RCT comes out it likely will not have statistical power calculations to reverse any real experts decision it will just prolong the controversy. This is not my first rodeo with pharmaceuticals, this drug clearly either has no effect or a VERY small one and when there is this much bias towards it we will never get a real answer as to what exactly the effect is since there will be gas lighting on both sides. I would personally invest my energy on immunological therapies and vaccines.

Its funny HCQ is literally studied with any new virus and everytime its the same shit that goes on and every time eventually its shown that it is not effective but this time one political side has just taken over and its no longer about the science.
I do appreciate an honest answer from you! Thank you for answering questions #3.
Let hope a vaccine or any immunology treatment can be found quickly so people don't have to die and our economy can avoid a severe recession or a depression!

PS. Personally I myself will be demanding my doctor prescribed me HCQ & Zpak & zinc at the very first symptom of covid19 ( Example lost of smell or loss of taste). That is my choice and I understand the risk!
Death from HCQ is extremely low. Hell every drugs to have side effect! Even overcounter NAIDS ( Aspirins) can kill you!
 

Valcazar

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WHAT?!

You are citing a poll posted on an ALT right website as evidence yet you go around saying Only Multi-Center double blind Randomized Controll Trials whenever someone cites a paper against HCQ.... give me a fucking break
To be fair, even the AMA put out a statement on doctors hoarding it back when it first got hyped by the president. It was never clear whether it was really happening or if it was whether or not it as driven mostly by people worried they wouldn't be able to get it for patients it is indicated for due to a panic.
 

Valcazar

Just a bundle of fucking sunshine
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Its funny HCQ is literally studied with any new virus and everytime its the same shit that goes on and every time eventually its shown that it is not effective but this time one political side has just taken over and its no longer about the science.
So true. Known antivirals tend to get studied with any new virus. They all are sort of promising at the start but almost never pan out as really worth it. Rarely, we get lucky and something turns out useful in the new scenario.
 

Ben19

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I do appreciate an honest answer from you! Thank you for answering questions #3.
Let hope a vaccine or any immunology treatment can be found quickly so people don't have to die and our economy can avoid a severe recession or a depression!

PS. Personally I myself will be demanding my doctor prescribed me HCQ & Zpak & zinc at the very first symptom of covid19 ( Example lost of smell or loss of taste). That is my choice and I understand the risk!
Death from HCQ is extremely low. Hell every drugs to have side effect! Even overcounter NAIDS ( Aspirins) can kill you!
That is fair. Honestly I don’t disagree with that. The evidence is low but at the end of the day a job of a doctor is to help YOU decide on what treatments you want as long as it’s not reasonably doing harm. If there is a potential for a small benifit and some potential for a risk but your mind is set on it then I personally think it’s reasonable choice.

To be fair, even the AMA put out a statement on doctors hoarding it back when it first got hyped by the president. It was never clear whether it was really happening or if it was whether or not it as driven mostly by people worried they wouldn't be able to get it for patients it is indicated for due to a panic.
I did not know about the AMA statement interesting. Hmm it’s just so unfortunate there is so much drama associated with this one drug. Honestly this has been a great lesson that politicians coming out in favour of something just adds so much periphery that’s it becomes hard to navigate through all the hype fake news and bias. The hype may help boost sales but it certainly doesent help people study it and understand the drug.
 

mandrill

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The US doctors taking Trump’s lead on hydroxychloroquine – despite mixed results

Jessica Glenza 11 hrs ago

There is an alternate universe of Covid-19 misinformation masquerading as science, which with the encouragement of Donald Trump, is proliferating among his supporters.

Among the most ardent proponents of these claims is the American Association of Physicians and Surgeons (AAPS), a fringe group of less than 5,000 doctors. The group was recently cited by Trump’s campaign manager, Brad Parscale, to explain the president’s stunning announcement that he is taking the drug hydroxychloroquine in an attempt to protect himself against Covid-19 despite a lack of evidence of its effectiveness.

When asked what evidence guided the president’s decision-making, Trump said: “Are you ready? Here’s my evidence: I get a lot of positive calls about it.”

Since hydroxychloroquine was approved on an emergency basis by the Food and Drug Administration (FDA), studies have shown mixed results, and the dangers of potentially life-threatening side-effects for patients.
Yet Dr Jane Orient, executive director of AAPS, told the Guardian she believed the drug “should be prescribed more often”, and in a statement based on a flawed database claimed the drug offered “about 90% chance of helping Covid-19 patients”.

“I’ve talk to a lot of doctors who are prescribing it [in the US], they are not reporting any problems, their patients have done very well,” she said. She did not say how many doctors she knew were prescribing it, and declined to answer whether she herself was prescribing it.
“I don’t want to have a target put on my back … which could result in somebody wanting to scrutinize my entire practice,” Orient said.
At first glance, the AAPS has the imprimatur of science. Its members rank among America’s most trusted professionals, and yet it has a track record unlike any other professional medical association.
“They seem frequently to offer advice and opinions about medical practice that are not consistent with evidence-based medicine,” said Dr Michael Carome, an expert on drug and medical device safety at Public Citizen, a public advocacy group.
“They’re aligned with the Trump administration, that doesn’t believe in science, doesn’t believe in fact. They’re completely compatible with the Trump White House.”
This group is lobbying on behalf of what they believe to be right, but invariably experts would disagree on their stance on hydroxychloroquine
John Ayers
The group has questioned whether HIV causes Aids (it does), argued abortion causes breast cancer (it does not), linked vaccines to autism (repeatedly debunked), and even alleged former president Barack Obama used hypnosis techniques to trick voters, especially Jewish people, into supporting him (no).
“The name does not determine the quality of the group,” said John Ayers, a professor of infectious disease and global public health who studies misinformation at the University of California San Diego. “This group is lobbying on behalf of what they believe to be right, but invariably experts would disagree on their stance on hydroxychloroquine and other topics and issues,” said Ayers.
As far as the president’s pronouncements, Ayers said: “We don’t know if he’s actually even taking it.”
Even as Trump said he was taking the drug, some of America’s most respected institutions have begun to move away from it. Yale New Haven medical center, one of the most respected hospitals in the world, removed the drug from its Covid-19 protocol after three weeks of de-emphasizing it in clinical practice.
Massachusetts general hospital, another world-renowned academic medical center, is giving priority to remdesivir, a drug developed by Gilead, although hydroxychloroquine is provided on a case-by-case basis.
The FDA has issued stringent warnings about the drug’s potentially life-threatening side-effects and recommended patients on hydroxychloroquine be participants in a clinical trial, or undergo rigorous monitoring, possibly including “baseline [electrocardiogram], electrolytes, renal function and hepatic tests”.

© Provided by The Guardian Hydroxychloroquine was approved on an emergency basis by the FDA but studies have shown mixed results.

The AAPS’s statements on hydroxychloroquine are not its only dubious views on the Covid-19 crisis.
The US Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) has recommended wearing masks in public places to prevent asymptomatic people spreading the disease. In other words, it is mostly a selfless act which protects others.
But Orient argued that masks “are not free of side-effects” and that they “retard oxygen” to the brain. She later added: “I think one jogger even dropped dead.” One man in China reportedly suffered a collapsed lung while wearing a mask, though a doctor in the report said there was “no clear evidence” the mask caused the injury.
While prolonged use of some masks, such as N95 respirators, might cause lightheadedness and discomfort, loose-fitting cloth or surgical masks most commonly used by the public are highly unlikely to cause such severe side-effects.
Orient also voiced her support for lifting stay-at-home orders. “They are destroying the economy, they are destroying people’s lives, there is really no evidence they work,” she said. The economic and social impacts of the lockdowns have been devastating.
But, there is widespread evidence that stay-at-home orders work, and could have saved thousands more lives had they been imposed earlier. A recent Italian study found the stay-at-home order there prevented about 200,000 hospitalizations. Data from Columbia University found if lockdowns had been imposed in the US two weeks earlier, on 1 March, as many as 54,000 lives could have been saved.
AAPS was formed in 1943, in opposition to a proposal to provide Americans the sort of universal, government-run healthcare established just a few years later in the UK. The NHS would become one of the country’s proudest achievements.
Orient’s group is small, especially when compared with the mainstream American Medical Association (AMA) which has 240,000 members. But it is influential.

Trump’s first health and human services secretary, Tom Price, was a member of AAPS. In a 2011 video unearthed by the Washington Post, Price called Orient a “kindred” spirit. He said: “It’s always wonderful to be in the same room with Jane Orient. Jane has been a hero of mine.” Price later resigned after spending $1m in taxpayer funds on private jets.
AAPS has diligently worked against proposals which would constrain doctors. For example, it sued the Texas medical board to force it to stop relying on anonymous complaints of misconduct against doctors (the group lost).
“Most recently, like Trump, they encourage the use of hydroxychloroquine for treatment of Covid-19, and they think that any oversight – be it a physician group or state medical board or mainstream medicine – that makes recommendations against use of that drug or tries to restrict use of that drug is just an affront,” Carome said.
They think that any oversight … that makes recommendations against use of that drug or tries to restrict use of that drug is just an affront
Dr Michael Carome
The view of AAPS, he added, is “that doctors should be basically free to do whatever they want to do, regardless of the level of evidence, and that’s a dangerous perspective for medical practitioners to have in the 21st century”.
Samantha Barstow, a licensed pharmacist and adviser on drug shortages with the company Lumere, said this was a rare and uncomfortable situation for government to be involved so directly in prescribing, but in this case it was necessary.
“The use for Covid-19 has not significantly been substantiated,” Barstow said. “The efficacy data is just not there yet.” In the meantime, drug shortages could cause patients with approved uses, such as rheumatoid arthritis and lupus, to suffer without medication.
Only six drugs have ever been approved on an emergency basis, like hydroxychloroquine, and most recently Gilead’s remdesivir. Some researchers believe past drugs approved this way offer a lesson.
In 2009, during the H1N1 influenza pandemic, a drug called peramivir showed promise. It was studied in three clinical trials, but despite compelling and transparent scientific evidence, it failed. By contrast, hydroxychloroquine was backed only by limited lab tests and case reports.
Nevertheless, Orient argues hydroxychloroquine should be available over the counter. Concerns from scientists have “nothing to do with concerns about safety and concerns about science”, she argued. Her view that lockdowns are “despotic, tyrannical and completely unwarranted”, and will probably also cause consternation in many circles.
But on some subjects, all can agree: “Our pandemic preparedness on the whole has been lousy.”


https://www.msn.com/en-ca/news/worl...ite-mixed-results/ar-BB14wPYV?ocid=spartandhp
 

PornAddict

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The Lancet retracts hydroxychloroquine study following data concerns


One of the world’s most prestigious medical journals, The Lancet, has retracted an influential COVID-19 research paper after three of the paper’s authors said the patient data used for the study could not be independently verified.


https://globalnews.ca/news/7027598/lancet-retracts-hydroxychloroquine-study/
 

PornAddict

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https://marlin-prod.literatumonline.com/pb-assets/Lancet/pdfs/S0140673620312903.pdf


The Lancet Journal
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COMMENT|ONLINE FIRST
Expression of concern: Hydroxychloroquine or chloroquine with or without a macrolide for treatment of COVID-19: a multinational registry analysis

The Lancet Editors
Published:June 03, 2020DOI:https://doi.org/10.1016/S0140-6736(20)31290-3
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Important scientific questions have been raised about data reported in the paper by Mandeep Mehra et al—Hydroxychloroquine or chloroquine with or without a macrolide for treatment of COVID-19: a multinational registry analysis1—published in The Lancet on May 22, 2020. Although an independent audit of the provenance and validity of the data has been commissioned by the authors not affiliated with Surgisphere and is ongoing, with results expected very shortly, we are issuing an Expression of Concern to alert readers to the fact that serious scientific questions have been brought to our attention. We will update this notice as soon as we have further information.
 
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PornAddict

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Basically the Lancet paper was garbage! Data was fraudulent! Guess Any Medical Doctors or Medical Teaching Hospital organization that is associated with that paper submitted now look really stupid now! This will destroy their reputation and their medical career who wrote that RCT paper on HCQ ! For Lancet to allowed that paper to be published on their most prestigious medical journal ( peer reviewed )...wow they look really stupid & now they got egg in their face!
Guess there a lot of TDS affecting their organizations to allow it fraudulent data to be published!

Like I said before follow the DATA! You need a double blind random control trial using these drugs ( HCQ, zpak, Zinc) & placebo and than measuring the Zinc level in the blood and give the HCQ as earlier as possible before the incubation stage or as soon as you got a symptom of covid19).

PS. If Trump had said HCQ don't work bet the mainstream media will be screaming bloody murder and want a proper double blinded random controlled Trial on HCQ! Guess everyone who against HCQ letting their emotions affect their better judgement! Just follow the data once and for all design a fucking double blinded random controlled for HCQ, zpak, and Zinc! Give to the patient early as possible!

PPS. It fucking criminal to allow a a fraudulent HCQ paper to publish in the Lancet the first place without having to checking the data! It took them( Lancet) to 14 days to retract that garbage paper ... gosh this leftie really suffer from Trunp deranged syndrome!
 
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PornAddict

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News was HCQ testing stopped because of the Lancet journal research saying its NOT effective against covid patients at later stages of the disease. NO SHIT! Same is to be said with other late stage diseases and drug effectiveness.

Trump is a fool for taking HCQ because its bogus and unsafe.

The WHO CEASED immediate study on the drug due to its health side effects.

The left laughed and anyone using the drug or thought s of using it were laughable.

Yesterday, the WHO wants testing to CONTINUE as the Lancet study was found to be flawed ..

Do you still support or take any advice from the WHO???

I dont.

https://time.com/5847664/who-hydroxychloroquine-covid-19/

https://www.cnbc.com/2020/06/03/wor...hydroxychloroquine-after-safety-concerns.html

Who can we trust??
A very valid question!
 
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PornAddict

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https://www.nationalreview.com/2020/06/trump-derangement-syndrome-at-the-lancet/

Trump Derangement Syndrome at The Lancet

A retracted study about hydroxychloroquine’s dangers is another sign of the publication’s political bias poisoning its medical reports.
Remember when we were told that the administration of Donald J. Trump posed a pernicious threat to science and medicine? In an attempt to sharpshoot Trump’s most famous scientific claim, one of the world’s leading medical journals just blew off its own foot.

What other possible explanation can there be for the catastrophic failure of The Lancet’s thunderously hyped anti-hydroxychloroquine article, which this week was retracted after it was revealed to be unsubstantiated, if not a full-on hoax?

On May 22, the hugely influential medical journal published an article on the most talked-about drug of the coronavirus pandemic. In the midst of a public-health crisis, when one particular treatment is receiving inordinate attention, it is critically important for The Lancet and other medical journals to guide us with facts rather than add to the political noise. Lives were, and are, on the line.

Doctors who had some anecdotal evidence, but no clinical proof, that hydroxychloroquine might be part of an effective treatment for COVID-19 sufferers were desperate to learn whether the drug works, doesn’t work, or is downright harmful to such patients. The Lancet in effect constructed a flashing red neon stop sign warning the medical profession that the drug was worse than useless. This matters.

The New York Times and virtually every other media outlet took the study at face value; the Times ran the alarming headline, “Malaria Drug Taken by Trump Is Tied to Increased Risk of Heart Problems and Death in New Study.” The Washington Post ran this headline: “Antimalarial drug touted by President Trump is linked to increased risk of death in coronavirus patients, study says.” The World Health Organization and several other health organizations halted clinical trials of HCQ and several national governments altered policy for the same reason.

And all of this happened because the Lancet published a peer-reviewed “observational study” that had more red flags than May Day. Its shoddy, embarrassing, instantly debunked “study” comes from a strange source that not only does not have a gold-standard reputation in the medical-research field but looks highly dubious. What good is The Lancet if it’s going to publish any fool thing that comes across its desk? In publishing this “study,” The Lancet acted about as responsibly as the New York Times would have been if it published a story saying, “Government chemicals in the water are turning the frogs gay, says expert observer.”


The article was based on the claims of a tiny, previously obscure Chicago-area firm called Surgisphere, founded by Dr. Sapan Desai, who has been named in three medical malpractice suits unrelated to the latest controversy and also left his hospital job in February. Desai has said Surgisphere has eleven employees. As of last week, the firm had six employees listed on LinkedIn, and as the Guardian reported, these employees included a sci-fi writer and an “adult model.” Great: The world’s most important medical study is coming to you from Stephen King and a pinup girl. Among the other tasty nuggets unearthed by the Guardian’s investigation were that, until a few days ago, the “get in touch” link on Surgisphere’s homepage sent users to a template for a cryptocurrency website.

The Lancet gave its imprimatur to a shadowy group, which before May had never published in any peer-reviewed journal, has almost no past Internet history, and most of whose employees appear to have joined the firm just this year. It apparently did not wonder how a tiny company beat all of its more established competitors and managed, at an astonishing speed, to carry out a massive clinical trial involving 96,000 patients and 1,200 hospitals around the world. The study didn’t even identify which hospitals it supposedly got data from.


Where the underlying information is, nobody knows, because Surgisphere won’t tell us. It claimed, for instance, to have collected detailed health records from more than 4,000 patients from hospitals in Africa, though other professionals in the field say it’s especially difficult to get good data from that continent.

“This is a pretty important topic. Can we see the details behind these data please?” is a question you would ask. The Lancet didn’t. It just said, “Looks good to us, fellas!” And somebody hit ‘publish.’ Retracting the article on Thursday, The Lancet sheepishly told us, “Our independent peer reviewers informed us that Surgisphere would not transfer the full dataset, client contracts, and the full ISO audit report to their servers for analysis as such transfer would violate client agreements and confidentiality requirements.” We can’t show you our data because it’s a secret? The Lancet went along with this? “We can no longer vouch for the veracity of the primary data sources,” the journal added, raising the question of why it vouched for this unseen data in the first place. Surgisphere’s only other study published in a peer-reviewed journal, another COVID-19 paper published May 1 in the New England Journal of Medicine, was also retracted this week.

The two doctors who co-signed the study with Surgisphere’s Desai essentially shrugged and said, Hey, this is what they told us. Even now the editor of The Lancet, Richard Horton, is blasé about bungling a study about the most-discussed treatment for the worst public-health crisis in a century. He responded to a tweet saying there should be consequences for those who perpetuated this shambolic work by saying meekly, “Lessons not consequences I hope.”


I can’t think of any explanation for why The Lancet would make such a catastrophic mistake except that it was reading the study through the political equivalent of beer goggles. When you’re fired up with righteous rage about Donald Trump, and a paper comes across your desk that supports your priors about his being a dangerous ignoramus, you are capable of overlooking the most egregious, spectacular flaws. What The Lancet published is looking more and more like fiction.

The Lancet’s revulsion toward all things Trump is undisguised; last month it took the highly unusual step of publishing a blatantly political editorial calling for Trump’s ouster. This follows the politicizing of its pages for the purpose of damaging the reputation of the previous Republican president, George W. Bush: Its 2006 survey estimating the Iraq War led to some 650,000 excess deaths was widely questioned, including by the government of Iraq itself, whose spokesman said the study had no basis in reality. Leading experts in the scientific and medical communities are supposed to be rigorous thinkers. The Lancet episode is damning evidence that some of them, at the very highest levels, are allowing themselves to be steered by their political passions rather than by their reason.
 

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The Mysterious Missing Link - Anti-Malaria Drug & Zinc


Mystery surrounds why an anti-malaria drug is not being tested as a Covid-19 treatment in combination with zinc, which doctors say is crucial for efficacy.







As we reported recently, President Trump revealed he was taking hydroxychloroquine (HCQ) alongside zinc after reports that many doctors are doing the same to help ward off Covid-19.

Criticism of the President rose sharply after a non-randomised study published in the Lancet said that HCQ provided no benefit to hospitalised Covid-19 patients while being linked to increased deaths.

What the mainstream media did not point out is that the Lancet study failed to test HCQ with zinc. Other experts have found zinc to be vital for efficacy in this context.

Zinc, available as an over-the-counter supplement, has long been seen as an immune-system booster that helps develop immune cells, or antibodies, and can strengthen the body’s response to a virus.

American infectious disease specialist Joseph Rahimian explained that, in relation to Covid-19, zinc ‘does the heavy lifting and is the primary substance attacking the pathogen’. HCQ is said to work as a delivery systemfor zinc in fighting coronavirus.

Ironically, the Lancet study came out at the same time as it was reported that India’s premier health body had expanded use of HCQ as a preventive for key workers following three studies showing positive results.



Conflicting reports and political axe-grinding have thickened the fog of war on this, but we know a number of things:


HCQ has been around for decades and is a ‘safe’ treatment for malaria and other conditions including lupus and arthritis (as the BBC has acknowledged).

Many doctors (and India) use HCQ as a preventive measure, as President Trump is now doing. A survey of doctors by a leading American physician staffing firm found that 65 per cent would give HCQ to their own family as a prevention or treatment. The UK is now conducting trials into whether HCQ can help prevent Covid-19. Results are not expected before the end of the year, although there will be results sooner from similar trials in the US.

International experience suggests HCQ can be effective in tackling Covid. Reports from France, Italy and Spain point to positive results from the use of HCQ, while a number of other countries are seeing success including Turkey, Costa Rica, Algeria, Belgium and Bahrain. This month a Shanghai-based doctor reported that, in China, a combination of zinc, hydroxychloroquine and the antibiotic azithromycin ‘has been able to save coronavirus patients’.

Many prominent Americans are taking HCQ to treat Covid-19 (and recovering) even as opponents attack President Trump for following the lead of many doctors. Hall of Fame rock star David Bryan, best known as the keyboardist for Bon Jovi, tested positive and was treated with HCQ, among other things. By late April, he was said to have recovered. Former Democratic presidential candidate Amy Klobuchar has now admitted her husband was treated with HCQ after he contracted coronavirus. After his rapid recovery, Senator Klobuchar said (through gritted teeth): ‘I believe he did briefly take that drug.’

Sadly it doesn’t seem to be the priority of most mainstream journalists, and some in the scientific community, to report the facts on HCQ in a responsible manner. As political commentator Scott Adams recently pointed out, the corporate news (CNN, Fox News etc) has no credibility when it comes to reporting on pharmaceuticals. In this context, this may be partly due to politics, but it is also a result of their financial stake in drug advertising.

With regard to reporting of the Lancet’s finding about increased deaths, Adams asked whether this should be seen as a surprise ‘given that we know the HCQ can have some heart issues with people who already have heart issues. Do [elderly people who are dying from coronavirus] have strong hearts? Probably not’.

He added:

‘What they don’t do on CNN is mention that if you don’t test it with the zinc [then] I’m not sure that you’ve really tested the thing that has the most promise. Where is that [test]?’

He has a point. A number of doctors say zinc is essential.

California emergency physician Dr Anthony Cardillo said during a local television interview:

‘[HCQ] really only works in conjunction with zinc. Every patient I have prescribed it to has been very, very ill and within eight to twelve hours they were basically symptom-free and so clinically I am seeing a resolution.’




This frontline experience was backed up by a study by the New York University Grossman School of Medicine published this month. It found that those receiving the triple-drug combination (HCQ, with azithromycin and, crucially, zinc) ‘were 44 per cent less likely to die, compared with the double-drug combination (i.e. without zinc)’. https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2020.05.02.20080036v1

'As the study notes:‘This study provides the first in vivo evidence that zinc sulfate in combination with hydroxychloroquine may play a role in therapeutic management for Covid-19.’The above makes the question of why zinc was not used in the Lancet study more baffling. And why don’t the media note that the combination of zinc and HCQ is crucial?


As Scott Adams put it:‘When they say the President is taking this drug that is killing people . . . it is not true. It is basically a lie . . . Both Fox News and CNN are doing something is completely illegitimate . . . I don’t know any reason you would do that other than to mislead.

'Sadly, with a Presidential election approaching, it’s doubtful whether the barrage of fake news over this treatment will be replaced by professional reporting. We can only hope that the truth – whatever it may be – will win out in the end.
 
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https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2020.05.02.20080036v1

Hydroxychloroquine and azithromycin plus zinc vs hydroxychloroquine and azithromycin alone: outcomes in hospitalized COVID-19 patients

Philip Carlucci, Tania Ahuja, Christopher M Petrilli, Harish Rajagopalan, Simon Jones, Joseph Rahimian
doi: https://doi.org/10.1101/2020.05.02.20080036
This article is a preprint and has not been peer-reviewed [what does this mean?]. It reports new medical research that has yet to be evaluated and so should not be used to guide clinical practice.
AbstractInfo/HistoryMetrics Preview PDF
Abstract

Background: COVID-19 has rapidly emerged as a pandemic infection that has caused significant mortality and economic losses. Potential therapies and means of prophylaxis against COVID-19 are urgently needed to combat this novel infection. As a result of in vitro evidence suggesting zinc sulfate may be efficacious against COVID-19, our hospitals began using zinc sulfate as add-on therapy to hydroxychloroquine and azithromycin. We performed a retrospective observational study to compare hospital outcomes among patients who received hydroxychloroquine and azithromycin plus zinc versus hydroxychloroquine and azithromycin alone. Methods: Data was collected from electronic medical records for all patients being treated with admission dates ranging from March 2, 2020 through April 5, 2020. Initial clinical characteristics on presentation, medications given during the hospitalization, and hospital outcomes were recorded. Patients in the study were excluded if they were treated with other investigational medications. Results: The addition of zinc sulfate did not impact the length of hospitalization, duration of ventilation, or ICU duration. In univariate analyses, zinc sulfate increased the frequency of patients being discharged home, and decreased the need for ventilation, admission to the ICU, and mortality or transfer to hospice for patients who were never admitted to the ICU. After adjusting for the time at which zinc sulfate was added to our protocol, an increased frequency of being discharged home (OR 1.53, 95% CI 1.12-2.09) reduction in mortality or transfer to hospice remained significant (OR 0.449, 95% CI 0.271-0.744). Conclusion: This study provides the first in vivo evidence that zinc sulfate in combination with hydroxychloroquine may play a role in therapeutic management for COVID-19.
 
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