Teachers Taking "Sick Days" - Anyone want to defend this one?

[DTECanada]

This is BS - the thread was about teacher's abusing sick days....now it is turning into a diatribe about creating lesson plans...most (uncommitted) teachers recycle their plans and tests year after year...byelection Aug 1st...any bets the teachers will be campaigning for the Fiberals

Diatribe: a bitter, sharply abusive denunciation, attack, or criticism.

Your comments are a diatribe. My comments about lesson plans are part of a constructive dialogue to improve education of children. If you prefer to misuse the English language and concentrate on sick days rather than being interested in improving education, that is your choice. Either educate or shut up.

 

[DTECanada]

With all the ills (no pun intended) in the education system, to focus on the fact that allotted sick days for teachers decreased from 20 to 11 and that teachers are actually using those eleven days is inane. Outrage over 11 sick days being used? Please. You should be happy that the allotted sick days were decreased from 20 (which is excessive) to a reasonable 11. However, it is clear that some people want to be outraged over it for whatever reason.
Don't misunderstand-I have my issues with unions, teachers, and education; but to focus on the use of eleven sick days is misdirected at best.

 

[Yoga Face]

So let me get this straight,...one day long ago,...a bunch of guys got together and decided that they would "develop" a economic "system" that would make only them rich,...and everybody else poor !!!
Tell me,... just what is this mysterious brotherhood, with the secret ceremonies and rituals that have passed this down through the ages ???

And the "rich", what ever the hell that means,...wanted the "recent financial collapse" in the US to happen ???

Also,...the subject profession in discussion,...did/do not "behave in self interest was demonstrated" recently ???

FAST

I never said capitalism started as a conspiracy just that the rich and powerful created the laws

Capitalism has done an amazing job of producing goods and allowing those with a humble start to get wealthy and I defend it but we must recognize its weaknesses

Self interest groups will always try to get power

Today the government is controlled by the powerful and rich

Especially in the USA

A superb example of this is wall street

The president established a committee to study the collapse

It came back and said it was manmade and here are some rules to stop it from occurring again

The head of that committee was on The Agenda (TVO) lamenting that not one rule has been incorporated because wall street has spent millions to stop any rules that restrict their ability to get rich

 

[Yoga Face]

+1

On a side note,...the very union in question here is probably the main reason why the voucher system will NEVER happen.

If there was even a hint that this was in the works,...the very next contract, agreed to by the self serving school boards, would include a buy out clause , for any teacher who lost their job that could even remotely be attributed to the system, that would bankrupt the whole country, let alone a prov.
And,…you would have every fricken civil servant union disrupting the whole country in (illegal) support.

Not gona happen !!!

FAST

Is that not ironic that the very union that says students are their main concern will stop any progress if it conflicts with their self interest?



For vouchers to happen will take organized civil action by parents and students IE walk outs, sit downs at Queens Park

 

[oldjones]

Agreed

Is that not ironic that the very union that says students are their main concern will stop any progress if it conflicts with their self interest?



For vouchers to happen will take organized civil action by parents and students IE walk outs, sit downs at Queens Park

Teacher unions are like any other; their main concern is their members' welfare. It's what they exist for and anyone believing otherwise should repeat kindergarten until they acquire the elementary common sense of a child.

Teachers' main concern is their students. That's one of the reasons they formed a union to look after less important and distracting stuff for them. Like arguing about paycheques and sickdays.

 

[guelph]

The teachers today are despicable in there behaviour compared to the teachers they had growing up. A terrible example to society where everyone has no more honour in their own profession today.

I don't know about that we had some pretty bad teachers in my day. The beatings that got laid on us would put them in jail today.

 

[CTSblues]

Diatribe: a bitter, sharply abusive denunciation, attack, or criticism.

Your comments are a diatribe. My comments about lesson plans are part of a constructive dialogue to improve education of children. If you prefer to misuse the English language and concentrate on sick days rather than being interested in improving education, that is your choice. Either educate or shut up.

I was accused of being arrogant for using the word "intractable"; you will be sorry for using "diatribe".

Don't misunderstand-I have my issues with unions, teachers, and education; but to focus on the use of eleven sick days is misdirected at best.

Politics of resentment/envy. When I read this,

Although Ontario earned one of the highest rankings - it's school system is rated as "great" - the province manages to spend thousands of dollars less per pupil than countries including the United States, Denmark and Iceland, which all earned a rating of "good."

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news...mong-best-in-world-report-says/article567927/

I know somebody is trying to create dissension among the natives, not that the system is perfect by any means.

 

[Yoga Face]

I don't know about that we had some pretty bad teachers in my day. The beatings that got laid on us would put them in jail today.

I remember this one teacher would pull down the pants of this one trouble maker then strap him on his ass.

This trouble maker was crying out for attention because his parents would always lay a beating on him. The teacher was too incompetent to see what the problem was and made it worse.


It was in this atmosphere that I developed my passion for school vouchers.

Your education should not depend on the luck of the draw in getting quality teachers and classmates and if you are in a bad situation vouchers allow you to leave.

Vouchers are a human rights issue



It is called freedom.

 

[DTECanada]

I was accused of being arrogant for using the word "intractable"; you will be sorry for using "diatribe".



Politics of resentment/envy. When I read this,

Although Ontario earned one of the highest rankings - it's school system is rated as "great" - the province manages to spend thousands of dollars less per pupil than countries including the United States, Denmark and Iceland, which all earned a rating of "good."

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news...mong-best-in-world-report-says/article567927/

I know somebody is trying to create dissension among the natives, not that the system is perfect by any means.

Interesting. I guess it's the nature of the beast that some people focus on the strangest things. Some are so fond of conflict, or have grown so used to conflict. I've seen unions and management (not a teacher's union) argue about the color of carpets and walls. Like some people here, arguments are just ingrained in the fabric and end up focused on the oddest things.

Not to feed the beast, but there is one factor that became clear to me when I was teaching. When you interact with hundreds of kids each day, you are more prone to get sick. It's more likely to occur in a teacher's first couple of years until one's immune system adapts.

Someone mentioned recycled lesson plans. That does happen with some teachers, and it's regrettable. Stale lesson plans can be a problem. I saw some of it when I was teaching, but I also saw many teachers who adapted, improvised, and refined their plans.

 

[JohnLarue]

Teacher unions are like any other; their main concern is their members' welfare. It's what they exist for and anyone believing otherwise should repeat kindergarten until they acquire the elementary common sense of a child.

Teachers' main concern is their students. That's one of the reasons they formed a union to look after less important and distracting stuff for them. Like arguing about paycheques and sickdays.

You can not separate the two, they are linked at the hip
Teachers have been rewarded exceptionally well because of their union (inappropriately well rewarded)
But the cost of that reward is Teachers have to wear the evils of their union

Teachers as a group used students as bargaining pawns
Individual teachers can not claim that was their unions doing
The union either represents you or it does not

Teachers now have a lot of goodwill they need to repair, however I suspect they do not view it that way

 

[Yoga Face]

You can not separate the two, they are linked at the hip
Teachers have been rewarded exceptionally well because of their union (inappropriately well rewarded)
But the cost of that reward is Teachers have to wear the evils of their union

Teachers as a group used students as bargaining pawns
Individual teachers can not claim that was their unions doing
The union either represents you or it does not

Teachers now have a lot of goodwill they need to repair, however I suspect they do not view it that way

I agree with JohnLarue on this one

you cannot accept the benefits of a union then disclaim them when they embarrass you


a caveat

remember to be careful

if you do not agree with JohnLarue you are an "idiot" and a "Nitwit"

Stiglitz is a nobel prize winning economist who disagrees with John Larue on capitalism so Stiglitz is an "idiot"'


Milton Friedman believes in school vouchers as a way to make public schools competitive so he is also an "idiot" (completely unaffordable according to Larue even though no studies have been done)


Karl Marx is such an "idiot" it is beneath Larue to even discuss Marx. The corollary must be it is beneath Larue to have read Marx.

I feel honoured Larue has included me in such company


What acid will drip from the tongue of tomorrows Larue?

After all, I went from "idiot" to "nitwit"

Larue's tongue is a rare tool indeed. It gets sharper with use! :Eek:

 

[therocket]

I was accused of being arrogant for using the word "intractable"; you will be sorry for using "diatribe".

not sorry but wondering who is this DTECanada - what a pompous ass...I think I have averaged 2 annual sick days in the last 25 years - to suggest 11 days per year is reasonable for a nine month work year is really stretching it....

 

[basketcase]

not sorry but wondering who is this DTECanada - what a pompous ass...I think I have averaged 2 annual sick days in the last 25 years - to suggest 11 days per year is reasonable for a nine month work year is really stretching it....

As was posted earlier, 8.9/a is the private sector average. I'd put good money that teachers sick days for the past decade is right around there, even if prorated for 10 months work.

 

[Yoga Face]

I was accused of being arrogant for using the word "intractable"; you will be sorry for using "diatribe".

not sorry but wondering who is this DTECanada - what a pompous ass...I think I have averaged 2 annual sick days in the last 25 years - to suggest 11 days per year is reasonable for a nine month work year is really stretching it....

DTE seems like a good teacher to me

even though he dares to disagree with JohnLarue on vouchers (DTE is for them) therefore he must be an "idiot" according to Larue

sick days should be banished

they are abused

Offer them as personal days instead of a raise then cash them in if you do not use them

come in every day and you have your raise

use them then lose your raise if you are sick or not

why should I pay for your sickness caused by a bad lifestyle?



politicians sick days are unlimited FFS

 

[DTECanada]

Ladies and gentlemen we have a new definition of pompous: talking intelligently about things that really matter and caring about the education of children. Let's all be pompous!

 

[Yoga Face]

Ladies and gentlemen we have a new definition of pompous: talking intelligently about things that really matter and caring about the education of children. Let's all be pompous!

 

[buckwheat1]

lets keep to the topic sick days. This change from 20 to 11 days a year will cost big bucks. Teachers never had short term disability insurance and now they do
this will be a big ticket item for all concerned. Banked sick days are now locked at August 31st 2012 levels and the buy out still will happen when one retires using august 2012 salary at that time.

 

[frankcastle]

In previous threads on teachers I've suggested lots of ways to save money in the education system (e.g. get rid of the catholic board, start using school assets like unused buildings and properties to generate revenue, move from text books to ebooks, cut out the middlemen in office supplies just to suggest a few).

The discussion should go beyond just teachers but the gross inefficiencies and waste perpetrated by the government. Spending in general should be audited.

 

[frankcastle]

lets keep to the topic sick days. This change from 20 to 11 days a year will cost big bucks. Teachers never had short term disability insurance and now they do
this will be a big ticket item for all concerned. Banked sick days are now locked at August 31st 2012 levels and the buy out still will happen when one retires using august 2012 salary at that time.

In other words it will be years before we see savings from banked sick days.

 

[whatsinaname]

In previous threads on teachers I've suggested lots of ways to save money in the education system (e.g. get rid of the catholic board, start using school assets like unused buildings and properties to generate revenue, move from text books to ebooks, cut out the middlemen in office supplies just to suggest a few).

The discussion should go beyond just teachers but the gross inefficiencies and waste perpetrated by the government. Spending in general should be audited.

Why get rid of the catholic board?