The United States Must Not Be Part of Israel's Unlawful War on Iran

[Butler1000]

Without going into specific laws.....
While it is true that the Democrats were involved in Kosovo and Libya, and some low key interventions via drone strikes etc in other places, the Republicans have undoubtedly been more hawkish and war prone to invasions, regime changes and long lasting, expensive and serious war often in violation of international law and possibly US domestic law.
To say they are just as bad as each other is just false equivalence.

You are forgetting the Obama Surge. Vietnam. Allowing Gaza to entrench. Libya resulted in a failed state and about 50% of the migrant crisis. The surge extended the war to Trump/Biden. Vietnam? 50,000 servicemen killed, countless civilians, for nothing.

And the military budget is a bipartisan approved thing. That always passes. With increases. It's just that the GOP crows about it because their base likes it. The Dems do it all on the sly if they can, or with "great regret".

But they still do it.

And btw. It was GOP presidents that also ended Afghanistan, Vietnam, pulled troops for Beirut, and GOP politicians that call for non intervention policy.

Mostly window dressing for a smaller contingent of voters within the party. But it's there.

 

[Shaquille Oatmeal]

You are forgetting the Obama Surge. Vietnam. Allowing Gaza to entrench. Libya resulted in a failed state and about 50% of the migrant crisis.
And the military budget is a bipartisan approved thing. That always passes. With increases. It's just that the GOP crows about it because their base likes it. The Dems do it all on the sly if they can, or with "great regret".

But they still do it.

And btw. It was GOP presidents that also ended Afghanistan, Vietnam, pulled troops for Beirut, and GOP politicians that call for non intervention policy.

Mostly window dressing for a smaller contingent of voters within the party. But it's there.

Obama Surge - A war that the Republicans got the US into. The subsequent POTUS has to make decisions based on ground realities.
Gaza - not sure what you mean here. Gaza has been a problem since 1948.
The GOP doesn't just crow about it, they are actively more hawkish and aggressive than the Democrats.
Also it was Obama that started troop reduction in Afghanistan and Biden that ended it entirely. So while pointing out the surge, in a war that the GOP started, you are cherry picking facts as well on top of resorting to false equivalence.
The GOP calling for non-intervention is a MAGA thing, but essentially a lie. Case in point the Iran strikes.

 

[Butler1000]

Obama Surge - A war that the Republicans got the US into. The subsequent POTUS has to make decisions based on ground realities.
Gaza - not sure what you mean here. Gaza has been a problem since 1948.
The GOP doesn't just crow about it, they are actively more hawkish and aggressive than the Democrats.
Also it was Obama that started troop reduction in Afghanistan and Biden that ended it entirely. So while pointing out the surge, in a war that the GOP started, you are cherry picking facts as well on top of resorting to false equivalence.
The GOP calling for non-intervention is a MAGA thing, but essentially a lie. Case in point the Iran strikes.

Complete avoidance on my Vietnam point.

Obama promised to end the wars. He expanded them.

Complete avoidance on the real consequences of Libya.

Biden didn't have to supply ammo for a year to Israel. He could have reigned them in.

Biden followed the deal Trump made to leave Afghanistan.

I'd say the honour's are about even.

Remember. My point isn't cheerleading for one side, just pointing out they both follow the same playbook, and have since WW2. You can absolutely say on many domestic issues the GOP suck far more. But on war? Nope.

 

[Shaquille Oatmeal]

Complete avoidance on my Vietnam point.

Obama promised to end the wars. He expanded them.

Complete avoidance on the real consequences of Libya.

Biden didn't have to supply ammo for a year to Israel. He could have reigned them in.

Biden followed the deal Trump made to leave Afghanistan.

I'd say the honour's are about even.

Remember. My point isn't cheerleading for one side, just pointing out they both follow the same playbook, and have since WW2. You can absolutely say on many domestic issues the GOP suck far more. But on war? Nope.

Vietnam I agree. Libya I agree.
But your examples to support the point that "Republicans and Dems are as bad as each other" are thin is my point.
While I agree that America's foreign policy is generally aggressive, the Republicans are the far more aggressive ones as stated via my former examples.
To say they are about even is false equivalence.
The Republicans have started more wars, bigger wars, more expensive wars, have cost more human lives, have started wars that have lasted longer than the Democrats have and have the more hawkish rhetoric.
That is just objectively true.

 

[Butler1000]

Vietnam I agree. Libya I agree.
But your examples to support the point that "Republicans and Dems are as bad as each other" are thin is my point.
While I agree that America's foreign policy is generally aggressive, the Republicans are the far more aggressive ones as stated via my former examples.
To say they are about even is false equivalence.
The Republicans have started more wars, bigger wars, more expensive wars, have cost more human lives, have started wars that have lasted longer than the Democrats have and have the more hawkish rhetoric.
That is just objectively true.

You just can't admit it.

 

[Shaquille Oatmeal]

You just can't admit it.

It is you that is unable to admit it.
On balance, objectively the Republicans are the more hawkish and aggressive ones just looking at examples of war and aggressive foreign policy over the years.
There is degrees to this.

 

[Frankfooter]

Obama Surge - A war that the Republicans got the US into. The subsequent POTUS has to make decisions based on ground realities.
Gaza - not sure what you mean here. Gaza has been a problem since 1948.
The GOP doesn't just crow about it, they are actively more hawkish and aggressive than the Democrats.
Also it was Obama that started troop reduction in Afghanistan and Biden that ended it entirely. So while pointing out the surge, in a war that the GOP started, you are cherry picking facts as well on top of resorting to false equivalence.
The GOP calling for non-intervention is a MAGA thing, but essentially a lie. Case in point the Iran strikes.

Gaza you have to give to the dems, they own 1 year of the genocide and enabling it in the first place.
More important than who was in power, which wars were ever opposed by either party?

This stat is worth checking.

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1497134463557459995

 

[Valcazar]

This stat is worth checking.

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1497134463557459995

Comes from here.

Severe Humanitarian Disasters Caused by US Aggressive Wars against Foreign Countries - Global Times

www.globaltimes.cn

 

[Frankfooter]

Comes from here.

Severe Humanitarian Disasters Caused by US Aggressive Wars against Foreign Countries - Global Times

www.globaltimes.cn

So the US starts the most wars and has a government that is beholden to the rich, with no policy priorities coming from actual voters.
All of that before trump.

 

[Valcazar]

So the US starts the most wars and has a government that is beholden to the rich, with no policy priorities coming from actual voters.
All of that before trump.

If that's what you want to take away from that link, that's up to you.

 

[Frankfooter]

If that's what you want to take away from that link, that's up to you.

You think launching 81% of wars doesn't mean they start the most wars?

 

[Valcazar]

You think launching 81% of wars doesn't mean they start the most wars?

You think that article actually backed that statistic?
You said it was "worth checking".
Does that mean "just accept it without checking" in your world?

 

[Frankfooter]

You think that article actually backed that statistic?
You said it was "worth checking".
Does that mean "just accept it without checking" in your world?

I've done a quick check, what you list as a war is up for debate, but the number isn't unreasonable.
Nor is it unreasonable to argue that the US has started the most wars after WWII.