Discreet Dolls

Will spas enforce the vaccine passport?

BeaverCleaver

Member
Nov 3, 2002
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It would hamper their business in some ways, but encourage it in others. I want the risk to be as low as possible before I decide to jump back in. I want the girl I’m going to see vaccinated. I want anyone she might have seen before me to be vaccinated, too.

it doesn’t eliminate the risk, but given vaccinated people are like 5x less likely to get the virus in the first place, it’s still quite significant.
If you're still that scared, then stay home and avoid the spas altogether. Don't ruin things for the rest of us, please.
 
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fall

Well-known member
Dec 9, 2010
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You should never assume anything. Let me try to make this clear because you're not getting my point.

I am making no assumption at all about how many of the 80% get the thing or how many of the 20% don't get the thing and I'm not making assumptions about who's immune or how many have immunity. Nor is that the basis on which the government is proceeding, because, simply, there's really no accurate way to define those numbers.

I am saying that the government is basing its public health decisions at least in part on the percentage of the population who are vaccinated vs the percentage who are unvaccinated. That's what the government is doing. That is not an assumption of any kind on my part. That is what the government is doing. Therefore, those who are unvaccinated are, for the moment, running the show and causing more restrictions than would likely be needed if only more of them would get vaccinated, because that is the basis on which government decision-making is proceeding. Thus, the ~20% are dictating to the ~80%.

As long as a substantial portion of the population remains unvaccinated government imposed health restrictions will continue at least until COVID is reduced to an endemic rather than pandemic level in the province - which experts have suggested could happen partway through next year.

Pandemic means essentially out of control and unpredictable. Endemic means a largely predictable rate of infection without restrictions that can be planned for and managed (ie, no huge and sudden spikes that catch people by surprise and overwhelm the health system.)

Now if you're still going to accuse me of making personal assumptions about how many are or aren't infected, etc. then you're clearly not listening to me or you're incapable of understanding me.
True, assuming the government makes correct decisions. And this is a very big assumption.
 
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hedo rick

Active member
Jun 11, 2016
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If you're still that scared, then stay home and avoid the spas altogether. Don't ruin things for the rest of us, please.
As I’ve already stated repeatedly, I have stayed home, and I’ll continue to stay home unless and until the conditions improve to the point where I believe it’s safe to partake.

I can hold out as long as necessary. The break has been very good for my wallet.
 

sshotrr

Active member
Aug 21, 2001
878
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You're going by what the government is telling you and I'm pointing out that they are making incorrect assumptions.
Do you also realize that the government considers the following groups of people as unvaccinated, when it counts covid cases:
- those who got 1 shot
- those who got 2 shots, but got covid within 14 days of their second shot (similarly if someone dies within 14 days of taking their second shot, their death would count as an unvaccinated person)
- those who got 2 shots, but got covid 120 days after their second shot
The government has made certain decisions during this pandemic that someone knowledgeable enough would question including:
- pushing ahead with AZ vaccinations while many countries put on the breaks, because of the early safety concerns around blood clots that were appearing
- saying it's no problem to delay taking the second shot, because of shipment delays, meanwhile the vaccines were studied for a specific number of weeks apart and none of the pharmaceuticals backed that notion
- encouraging mixing vaccines, again because of shipment delays, which once again none of the pharmaceuticals backed and if you read the product monograph for the now approved Pfizer covid vaccine it says:
"There are no data available on the interchangeability of Pfizer-BioNTech COVID-19 Vaccine with other COVID-19 vaccines to complete the vaccination series. Individuals who have received one dose of Pfizer-BioNTech COVID-19 Vaccine should receive a second dose of
Pfizer-BioNTech COVID-19 Vaccine to complete the vaccination series."
Because of their gaffe the government had to ask other countries to let Canadian visitors enter, because many countries don't consider someone fully vaccinated by mixing vaccines, as such vaccines were not conceived to be used such a wat. And, the government had no choice but to start its own trial to try and support this experimental idea. You can read more about the MOSAIC trial here:
- one of the worse things the government did was extending the expiry of a batch of an AZ vaccine. That's a huge no no. Pharma companies deal with huge losses every year from scrapping expired drug. Yet instead of donating the vaccines that were to expire, in order not to lose the drugs, the government decided it would simply extend their expiry by 1 month. If pharma companies could do that as they please, they would save lots of money! There is a reason the expiry is a certain date and that's from the data the pharma company has come up with. If they could extend the expiry date, you could be sure they would and sometimes they do after producing the data to support this.
Anyway I could keep going, but I think you get the picture.
Many do get the picture . But the majority are letting the TV think for them . You have just scratched the surface of what makes no sence .
 

PeteOsborne

Kingston recon
Feb 12, 2020
2,163
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kingston
You know, you must show a valid ID with your name on it, right? I would prefer to stay anonymous.
Went to a MP where they had a small envelope that you slid your health card into that had a hole cut in the spot where your picture and last 4 digits of your OHIP card were.
They also had a manilla envelope that you slid your proof of vaccination receipt with holes cut to view the dose number, date and last 4 digits of your OHIP card so they could match it.
Name, D.O.B. and complete OHIP number not visible.
I thought that was a great idea for privacy.
 

squeezer

Well-known member
Jan 8, 2010
22,301
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Many do get the picture . But the majority are letting the TV think for them . You have just scratched the surface of what makes no sence .
You don't get the picture! 80% plus of adults have had their double dose and are fed up with folks who have not! You lost! Deal with it or stay home and enjoy home-cooked meals.
 

fall

Well-known member
Dec 9, 2010
2,740
680
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You don't get the picture! 80% plus of adults have had their double dose and are fed up with folks who have not! You lost! Deal with it or stay home and enjoy home-cooked meals.
Could you, please, support the "and" in your claim with the data. I am among the 80% of fully-vaccinated but I support people's right to refuse vaccine and I am against vaccine passports. You have a tendency to think and speak for other people based on your own beliefs.
 

PeteOsborne

Kingston recon
Feb 12, 2020
2,163
2,023
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kingston
Could you, please, support the "and" in your claim with the data. I am among the 80% of fully-vaccinated but I support people's right to refuse vaccine and I am against vaccine passports. You have a tendency to think and speak for other people based on your own beliefs.
https://nationalpost.com/news/tensi...work_boosting&utm_content=trending_broadsheet
77% of vaccinated polled have negative views of the unvaccinated.
What is interesting is that even 25% of the unvaccinated that were polled have negative views of other people who are unvaccinated.
 

fall

Well-known member
Dec 9, 2010
2,740
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https://nationalpost.com/news/tensi...work_boosting&utm_content=trending_broadsheet
77% of vaccinated polled have negative views of the unvaccinated.
What is interesting is that even 25% of the unvaccinated that were polled have negative views of other people who are unvaccinated.
Wow, something should be done about it. The hatred toward a specific group of people is not OK. The government should definitely do something about it. Maybe run a positive add complain saying that hate is "unCanadia", that all people have rights to refuse the vaccine and they should not be treated badly because of their choice.
 

squeezer

Well-known member
Jan 8, 2010
22,301
17,352
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https://nationalpost.com/news/tensi...work_boosting&utm_content=trending_broadsheet
77% of vaccinated polled have negative views of the unvaccinated.
What is interesting is that even 25% of the unvaccinated that were polled have negative views of other people who are unvaccinated.
Could you, please, support the "and" in your claim with the data. I am among the 80% of fully-vaccinated but I support people's right to refuse vaccine and I am against vaccine passports. You have a tendency to think and speak for other people based on your own beliefs.
I don't see an apology coming from you Fall. Come on, be a man and admit you were wrong.
 

fall

Well-known member
Dec 9, 2010
2,740
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I don't see an apology coming from you Fall. Come on, be a man and admit you were wrong.
You mean apologising for asking for a proof? Nothing wrong about asking, and I got the link that show that 77% of vaccinated have negative view of vaccinated which can be views as a weak support for your claim. But you are twisting the notion of "negative view". It does not show the exact question in the survey: if "negative" means that they are idiots and should get vaccinated (I would be the first to agree with such statement) or that they prolong pandemic and increase risk fro everyone by refusing to get vaccinated (I also agree with this statement) or that their right to do what vaccinated people can do should be reduced (I am strongly against this). So, "got fed up with" and "have negative view of" are very different things. I am not sure you understand it as for you the result justifies the methods, but for me these two feelings are not the same.
 

squeezer

Well-known member
Jan 8, 2010
22,301
17,352
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You mean apologising for asking for a proof? Nothing wrong about asking, and I got the link that show that 77% of vaccinated have negative view of vaccinated which can be views as a weak support for your claim. But you are twisting the notion of "negative view". It does not show the exact question in the survey: if "negative" means that they are idiots and should get vaccinated (I would be the first to agree with such statement) or that they prolong pandemic and increase risk fro everyone by refusing to get vaccinated (I also agree with this statement) or that their right to do what vaccinated people can do should be reduced (I am strongly against this). So, "got fed up with" and "have negative view of" are very different things. I am not sure you understand it as for you the result justifies the methods, but for me these two feelings are not the same.
You accused me of having a tendancy to speak for other people based on my beliefs. You are WRONG and yet you once again spin and twist but in the end, you just can't man up and accept you were wrong!
 

fall

Well-known member
Dec 9, 2010
2,740
680
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You accused me of having a tendancy to speak for other people based on my beliefs. You are WRONG and yet you once again spin and twist but in the end, you just can't man up and accept you were wrong!
yes, you have such tendency and you did it again saying that 80% of vaccinated are fed up with vaccinated instead of saying they have "negative view" of them. You always twist the data in your favour and change the wording to make it more consistent with your point of view. Not only you are speaking for other people, but you also change the other people words and claim that that they say something different than what they actually said.
 
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