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Civil War: MAGA in Turmoil

Valcazar

Just a bundle of fucking sunshine
Mar 27, 2014
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Data and conclusions from the FBI, DHS and CSIS disagrees with you.
I'm not sure that's true.
Yes, using small numbers for per capita is a problem because the error bars become way too big, but depending on how you cut the time frame, I am quite certain you can find data to say that there are a higher portion per capita coming from the muslim population.
(Mind you, most of those will be from citizens, not immigrants.)
 

Shaquille Oatmeal

Well-known member
Jun 2, 2023
8,232
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I'm not sure that's true.
Yes, using small numbers for per capita is a problem because the error bars become way too big, but depending on how you cut the time frame, I am quite certain you can find data to say that there are a higher portion per capita coming from the muslim population.
(Mind you, most of those will be from citizens, not immigrants.)
Which is why the ones arguing Islamic terror is the biggest threat in the west always like to include 9/11 in their stats.
It gives them the boost to the numbers they need.
 
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Phil C. McNasty

Go Jays Go
Dec 27, 2010
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If there were mistakes, and US citizens were infact deported, which you have agreed to already, then you cannot make the claim that no US citizens are being deported.
Even detaining a US citizen is unlawful.
You keep owning yourself. lmfao
I never said mistakes were never made.
That happens all the time.

What I said was US citizens are not being intentionally deported under Trump's order.

You on the other hand were insinuating that Trump was intentionally deporting US citizens, but now you're chickening out from your stupid argument because you have absolutely no evidence of this
 

Catwhiskers

New member
Apr 4, 2024
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3
He has. Both US citizens (which is outright illegal) and non-US citizens without due process.
So he has eroded democratic values and violated several amendments in the US constitution, which is unlawful.

We don't know yet. The motive is yet to be established.
However the majority of terrorism in the US is from right wing extremists as I said before.

He is not abiding by the constitution or the rule of law.
He has violated several constitutional amendments.
And no, it does not hurt my feelings as I am neither an American citizen nor do I live there.
I am only concerned about how his ideology poisons the minds of the youth and others in Canada, which I view as a threat. Rightfully so.
Thankfully we dodged a bullet earlier in the year.
Still at it you insane man!
 
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Shaquille Oatmeal

Well-known member
Jun 2, 2023
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I never said mistakes were never made.
That happens all the time.

What I said was US citizens are not being intentionally deported under Trump's order.

You on the other hand were insinuating that Trump was intentionally deporting US citizens, but now you're chickening out from your stupid argument because you have absolutely no evidence of this
No it doesn't happen all the time.
It happened under Trump because they were racially profiled and deported or detained hastily without due process.
Given this entire program is the Nazi Stephen Miller's policy initiative, who wants to make America white again, it is justified to suspect that these deportations are intentional.
 
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Phil C. McNasty

Go Jays Go
Dec 27, 2010
29,828
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No it doesn't happen all the time.
It happened under Trump because they were racially profiled and deported or detained hastily without due process.
Given this entire program is the Nazi Stephen Miller's policy initiative, who wants to make America white again, it is justified to suspect that these deportations are intentional
You again prove that you have no idea what you're talking about.
Wrongful deportations happened under the Obama regime as well.

Read: https://www.google.com/search?q=wer...DwgcHMi01LjEuMcgHPw&sclient=mobile-gws-wiz-hp
 

Valcazar

Just a bundle of fucking sunshine
Mar 27, 2014
37,692
77,210
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Here's the study proving it.
Thanks for the source.
Another recent one drawing on similar data.
 
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Shaquille Oatmeal

Well-known member
Jun 2, 2023
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You again prove that you have no idea what you're talking about.
Wrongful deportations happened under the Obama regime as well.
If it did, then that would also be unlawful and unconstitutional.
And just because it happened during the Obama administration doesn't make it okay for it to happen during the Trump administration especially when they have a policy position of mass deportations without due process.
 

Phil C. McNasty

Go Jays Go
Dec 27, 2010
29,828
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If it did, then that would also be unlawful and unconstitutional.
And just because it happened during the Obama administration doesn't make it okay for it to happen during the Trump administration especially when they have a policy position of mass deportations without due process
I never said it was okay, I merely said that the wrongful deportations happen by mistake under every administration, whether its Republicans or Democrats
 

The Oracle

Pronouns: Who/Cares
Mar 8, 2004
30,320
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On the slopes of Mount Parnassus, Greece
I never said it was okay, I merely said that the wrongful deportations happen by mistake under every administration, whether its Republicans or Democrats
''

he Obama administration utilized existing legal frameworks for deportations, primarily formal removal proceedings (which involve a hearing before an immigration judge and associated due process rights) and expedited removal (a faster process with limited judicial review). The administration also shifted focus to prioritize the removal of individuals who posed a threat to national security or public safety, such as those with serious criminal convictions or recent border crossers.

Formal Removal Proceedings
For many undocumented immigrants, particularly those apprehended in the U.S. interior and with established community ties, the primary mechanism was formal removal proceedings.
  • Immigration Court Hearings: Individuals had the right to a hearing before an immigration judge, where they could present their case, challenge the government's evidence, and apply for forms of relief from deportation (such as asylum, cancellation of removal, or other legal status).
    • Right to Counsel (at no government expense): Immigrants in these proceedings had the right to secure legal representation, though the government did not provide them with a lawyer.
    • Appeals Process: Decisions made by an immigration judge could be appealed to the Board of Immigration Appeals (BIA) and potentially to federal courts.
    • Prosecutorial Discretion: The administration encouraged the use of prosecutorial discretion to prioritize cases involving serious criminals and allow others, such as eligible parents of U.S. citizens (under the proposed DAPA program) and DACA recipients, to seek temporary relief from deportation.

Expedited Removal
The Obama administration continued the use of expedited removal authority, which allows immigration officers to quickly remove certain individuals without an immigration court hearing.
  • Eligibility: This process was primarily used for noncitizens apprehended at or near the border who lacked proper entry documents or used fraudulent ones, and who had not been continuously present in the U.S. for at least two years.
  • Limited Review: In these cases, due process was limited. However, individuals who expressed a fear of persecution or torture were entitled to a credible fear interview with an asylum officer to access the asylum system.

Due Process Concerns
Despite the existence of formal processes, the administration faced criticism from civil liberties and immigrant rights advocates regarding due process issues:
  • "Rocket Dockets": The administration created expedited hearings, or "rocket dockets," for families and unaccompanied children from Central America, which critics argued gave individuals less time to find adequate counsel and prepare their asylum claims, potentially violating due process.
  • Stipulated Removal: The use of stipulated removal, where detainees agreed to deportation without a full hearing, was also scrutinized. Reports suggested government officials sometimes provided misleading information, leading immigrants to waive their rights without fully understanding the consequences or their eligibility for relief.
In essence, the Obama administration followed existing legal procedures for deportations, which offered varying levels of due process depending on the specific circumstances and location of apprehension. The focus was on creating a more targeted system that prioritized serious threats while attempting to provide a path to temporary legal status for others through executive actions like DACA and DAPA.


This is what AI overview has to say...Sounds like a balanced way to go about things to me.
 

Phil C. McNasty

Go Jays Go
Dec 27, 2010
29,828
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You forget you are talking to Phil.
Yes, he is going to insist on a list of specific names and then insist each one doesn't really count.
It's his nature
He made an outrageous claim that US citizens were being deported, and yet couldn't even come up with any names.

I've only managed to find 4 so far, and those appear to be mistakes.
Trump is not deporting US citizens intentionally
 

Valcazar

Just a bundle of fucking sunshine
Mar 27, 2014
37,692
77,210
113
I never said mistakes were never made.
That happens all the time.

What I said was US citizens are not being intentionally deported under Trump's order.

You on the other hand were insinuating that Trump was intentionally deporting US citizens, but now you're chickening out from your stupid argument because you have absolutely no evidence of this
What has been insinuated is that the Trump regime is intentionally not bothering to not make mistakes.
Their entire approach has been one where sweeping up citizens isn't a concern.
And, to be fair, they know that people like you will defend it, so they thought the fallout of doing it this way wouldn't be too bad.
 
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